I'm learning there's not enough meaningful difference between a lift done in a show and a lift done in a competition. If it's L4 in competition, it's L4, end of. The supporting partner's blade run speed, the liftee's rotational speed around her partner's shoulders/neck, the degree and type of pelvis support in the final position, the type of skating done before and afterwards, the degree and nature of the prep before, and the set down/recovery after - all of this insufficiently mitigates the risk Virtue and Moir undertake.
Before I was schooled, I'd have said that in this lift, Tessa has her core pasted to her husband and, again, is actually using her upper chest/back/neck to arch back. And I'd have said that she's carefully set down at almost no speed, with her feet planted particularly wide apart (For Tessa. For Meryl Davis it would be typical.). Now I know better.
Some people who've watched this video of Scott and Tessa skating "Let it Snow" seem to believe Tessa isn't just pulling a Meryl Davis by skating without fully engaging/opening up from her core, specifically, her pelvis and hips, as she's used to do, but that she also doesn't extend her free leg above hip level - or even at hip level. I've learned those people need their heads examined.
 |
| Lesson: This here was an accident when they lost their timing out of a lift. Momentum and all. One of these days they'll really mess up, and Scott's penis will go right in. |
Addressing a comment below, asking how does one explain the part "where she's supported only by her thighs and is arching everything including her pelvis": how do you know she's arching everything including her pelvis? From this (key screencaps)?
Observations. Her knees are spread apart, which eases pressure on both pelvis and lower back. She's positioned fairly high up on his torso, his hands are under her skirt supporting the small of her back, and as she rolls up her spine out of the upside down position, you see her lower pelvis is against Scott. She's working the hell out of her shoulders and really extending, dangling those arms to extend the visual impression of the oversway. She's got more of her rib cage engaged than when she holds a more extended arch, but gravity's helping her here. Her hips, lower pelvis and lower back are secured by Scott, going by how that part of her body remains in place/still as she rolls up her spine.
The bottom of the sweater just above the hem hangs a little stiffly. Tessa rotates around Scott's shoulders, she extends her arms over her head while her upper body is upside down, and that sweater never rides up. The skirt gets pushed up and flipped up, but that sweater is super-glued to Tessa's skirt.
_______________________
*Others have a different take. They believe that while the non-pregnant Tessa was recovering from her second round of CES surgery, she was spending tons of time in the gym, and thrilled to be there, as it had been so long. Tessa said this, so they know it's true. Prior to her second surgery, she didn't even feel like an athlete, because she couldn't train like one in a regular gym. Afterwards, she could, and what a treat. Besides, she clearly acquired a bucketload of muscle she hadn't had in Vancouver.
While finally, at long last, able to "train like an athlete", and while acquiring new muscle, which, we're told, burns calories more efficiently than fat, Tessa got wider and wider through the fall, apparently because she'd decided to slack off a bit and gorge on steroid-injected chocolate throughout the summer and through the balance of 2010. Who doesn't pile on the pounds in Nov-Dec while aiming for Canadians in January, followed by the 4CCs in February, and prepping for their World Championship title defense in Moscow.
P.S. Reflecting back on Scott's rampage through London on Victoria Day weekend (and Tessa's birthday!), and also reflecting on the blog's prior referencing of the movie Soapdish, I'm kind of curious if maybe some of Scott's buddies weren't going around London playing the part of "Rose" to Scott's "Celeste." Yes, Scott Moir is a London favorite son, and it was a big weekend. Still, without Tessa next to him, he doesn't stand out in a crowd. Furthermore, both Scott and Tessa seem tinier in person than they do on television. Yet so so so many people spotted Scott Moir that weekend. Many of the sightings were presumably authentic, as in, not plants deputized to tweet his whereabouts and behavior. But, as to recognizing Scott Moir in the first place, I wonder if that part didn't get a little boost. Going by reports of their behavior, they were amping it up. A bunch of guys tweeted about his boorishness, and how many guys, even in London, are ice dance fans who can pick Scott Moir out of a crowd of revelers, even assholes, without a little assistance?
ETA: to supplement the discussion below, this link: What is public relations provides an irreverent but on point overview of how public relations minions operate. Try to visualize Virtue and Moir's bastardized, Rube Goldberg set-up - family, friends, mentors, pros, etc. all wanting to play their role. And at the end of the day, the people who are spending the most time on it are those surrounding the celeb, not the celeb themselves. It's set up, everything's in place, and then the celeb (or Virtue Moir) just steps in for the photo op, publicity stunt, or other. It's not Scott and Tessa running the logistics. They have their lives and schedule, and what's in the area of p.r. is coordinated by others, so they just have to show up. That's how it works.
It was extremely interesting to read the posts from the person who observed up-close another couple's shamming in front of the public.
ReplyDeleteCould that person please share what specific things you observed about VM that tipped you off? You also mentioned being able to predict what was coming next. Could you elaborate on that? Thanks.
It was also interesting that there seemed to be a general consensus that VM are in a better position, relationship-wise, and probably wouldn't end up divorcing, like the other couple did. That stood out to me because I would think the added complication of children could potentially create huge problems. I hope not, but it would seem that way.
I don't know who the other couple is, but it seems to me Virtue and Moir are in a better position because they're married and have started a family together, and the other couple didn't make it. My impression is the other duo were movie stars, and that means that they worked apart, if not all the time, then some of the time. If you're a film star in a relationship with another film star, most of your life is about your film stardom or acting career. You're on B'way, she's in Tibet. That's how it works. Versus Scott and Tessa whose families were close, who came from the same community, who grew up together not on a film set but on a skating rink pursuing something very athletic, very technical, very challenging, that required and extremely scheduled life all pointing towards a shared goal. The other sham couple might have had more of a struggle getting on the same page, finding shared goals, because film careers don't move in tandem. Tessa and Scott's entire lives moved in tandem. That makes it easier. Basically the pressures and challenges the other sham had in making it work are the opposite of Scott and Tessa's situation. I imagine it was difficult to make it work AND play those games. Whereas Scott and Tessa are joined at the hip and playing those games. There's somebody trying to "get their head around" the sham in the original comments section, and one thing they can't get their head around is that what's in the camera frame is not all that's there. Tessa could be taking the damn picture. There have been times Tessa wasn't there, possibly at a couple of (non-beach) Moir-connection weddings, and I'm sure she hated to miss them. :P And when she, Jordan and her mom were in Monaco for the "french family" wedding and to help set up the coming Monaco wedding with Scott, and Scott was in the Dominican with the three Dube sibs. But Tessa is there.
ReplyDeleteI'd point this person to a video the blog made, showing the chronology of February 22, 2010 at the PNE after Scott and Tessa won Olympic gold. It concludes with Jessica being "helped down from the stands" to enact a hug with Scott as his mother snapped a photo and they were surrounded by other skaters, their coaches, his parents, Tessa's dad, and their training mates. Then the video ended but it so happens Bryce was back there. He just didn't go to the Kiss'n"Cry for the photo op. Pretty sure Jessica was handed off to him when the photo op was done.
This is a little OT, but it seems to me when many fans think of 'sham' they mainly think of a gay guy dating a woman as a beard. There are other shams. Apart from Scott and Tessa, and until the person here shared their story, the most common sham "I've" known about went the other way. A couple like Sale & Pelletier presenting as together when they've been apart for nearly two years. I didn't know it about them, but I've known other situations where it was in the best business/public relations interests of a couple to maintain the public front as a couple while the reality is they're no longer together. Especially when two people are both high profile, that becomes part of what they perceive as their brand, and one or the other may feel they'd take a hit (be seen as the rejectee or loser) if they split up, so it's agreed to continue on until his show is over or her movie's out, or until one or the other falls in love with someone else. It's pure front, the married couple can get divorced and simply not announce it, while appearing in public, and the living together or bf/gf can just hit the red carpet and enact the occasional "Starbucks run" or "dog walk" (or "with our kid in the playground") pap walk to establish the life off the red carpet, and done.
DeleteI'm a big fan of 30 Rock, and as farcical as it is, if anybody wants to get an easy intro to some show business games, I'd watch those re-runs. The stuff Tina Fey puts in there, she doesn't get out of thin air. One episode featured James Franco playing a version of himself. He and his manager wanted to contract for Jenna to be his sham girlfriend, in order to conceal his relationship with a Japanese body pillow. :) (that's Fey's snark, the body pillow, but the actual scenario actually happens. My favorite part was the details. Three dates a week. One morning leave his house wearing his shirt. When they fight, have a fight in a Jamba Juice because he's got a contract with Jamba Juice.
Of course it's amped up, but the reality is, those details are considered by real life hoaxers/shammers (wear my shirt).
I think when looking at these kinds of games played by celebrities and public figures there tends to be an incomplete logic that goes something like this:
DeletePartner A is very outgoing, loves to socialize, enjoys partying, likes the limelight, etc. Partner B is an introvert, doesn't enjoy the limelight, is academic, wants to stay in and read, etc.
V/M like to play up this kind of public storyline about themselves. It somewhat fits the characterizations they've created for themselves publicly. Scott is the outgoing, brash, funny guy. Tessa is his straight man, more reserved, and introverted. Even when Scott says something like "Tessa is really funny, but not many people get to see it," he's still working those somewhat prepackaged generalizations. Indicating she's funny in private that's not how she would act in a larger crowd of people, etc.
There's an assumption, driven by that storyline, that V/M have nothing in common with one another off the ice. They're so different in personality, the storyline goes, that they not only have different, possibly conflicting feelings about the sport of ice dance and their future, but that it also sometimes negatively impacts their abilities to communicate with one another off the ice. In other words, the skating is their anchor. Without it, they have a hard time functioning as a couple. It's awkward.
That's kind of how they structured their reality show narrative, though there were most likely other motivations behind that as well. Not only was the intent to push a fake "platonic" storyline, but there may have also been a "not so much underlying as it was blatantly ridiculous" need to prove Scott isn't gay.
But V/M are married and they've had a child (with another possibly on the way). They may be somewhat different in personality, but there's almost no chance they are not joined at the hip, are basically two peas in a pod, and do almost everything together. Which isn't to say they wouldn't have their own friends they spend time with on occasions, but the assessment that they don't have the same general likes or plans for the future? No, that's not how it works.
It's why I've never understood how people can assume Scott is more comfortable with lying, faking photographs than Tessa, or vice versa. They're both participating in various ways. If one is on vacation, the other is almost always there. Just because a fake girlfriend shows up in a photograph on a fucking horse next to Scott does not mean Tessa wasn't there. If he's into it, she's into it.
"Could that person please share what specific things you observed about VM that tipped you off? You also mentioned being able to predict what was coming next. Could you elaborate on that? Thanks"
ReplyDeleteI touched on it in my post before talking about how we knew something was coming because they would talk about the other, or appear at the same event (not with each other, of course), or do something cute that related to the other, or be asked about the other in an interview and flush and fumble and lie horribly... I also talked about how they would hint at coming out and then replace each other with yet another publicity stunt. I think OC used the Lucy football analogy for something and that's what it felt like sometimes. At some point, you learned not to go for the kick, or more importantly, not trust Lucy to hold the ball for you. Therefore, anytime I see VM do something adorable and showing us a glimpse of their real life outside of skating (i.e. Twitter day), I'm automatically conditioned to cringe.
It was also discussed by many others on here about the patterns. Once you watch things happen over and over again, it becomes easy to predict. I feel this is even more so true with VM, because this first couple would take what fans/press called them out for, and fix it the next time. VM seem to stick to the same script because nobody is calling them out outside of this group and since nobody gives this place an ounce of credence (or say they do), they bank on that.
In regards to believing VM's real story, it was just some of the ways they answered questions in interviews and lied and contradicted themselves or stories. I also have eyes to see how they look at each other and touch each other constantly in a way that's just way too familiar that gives them away. I know 17 years builds a comfortability around one another, but there are other long partnerships that don't make out and gaze and caress, etc.There's also probably some subtle nuances I picked up from watching the other couple over the years that I can't explain... I just know and feel and I can see it with VM. It's so obvious something is "off". If you laid out the entire story piece by piece and tried to take it all at face value, it wouldn't make any sense. You couldn't do it. Therefore, there has to be a lie (or many) somewhere. If someone, anyone, lies to you about something, then it makes it hard to know when and about what they're telling the truth. All bets are off, and you just have to do the best you can to stick to what you know is the truth and build from there. Obviously if something has multiple stories linked to it, it's most likely not the truth. There also may be a slimmer of truth to it that gets embellished to tell a similar or completely different version of the actual truth.
Anyways, there are probably specific examples if I really thought about it, and if I do I'll let you know... but honestly I've watched so much media and read so much stuff from different sources trying to piece together that truth over the past few weeks, while disbelieving there's yet another couple doing this, that I can't think of anything at the moment.
I hope for them and their kid(s) sake that everything does work out ok for them. I will choose to think positively about that unless I hear otherwise. I know that having kids in the mix can definitely make things more complicated and stressful, but it can also strengthen bonds and pull families together. While I don't think protecting kids is their only reasoning here, I do think it does come largely into play, and I think that Family is HUGE for both of them, (even though the idea of keeping up the charade and appearances for certain things can get in the way and start to take precedence over those actual things). One of the other genuine things I feel we see from them is how they interact with not only their own families, but with each other's families and how supportive everyone is. I don't think anyone wants to let that go.
@ 5:39 from the first comments section
Delete"What do you mean by this? That you called them out publicly or privately. Why did they call you fans if you were their friends?
And when you say it didn't end well - did they break up after coming clean, or did the reveal never happen at all?"
We called them out publicly because in the beginning we were just fans. The "crazy fans" moniker was given to us by other fans of theirs. In addition, their (individual) fans really didn't like the idea of the two of them together. No clue why, they were adorable and clearly made each other happy... guess they were jealous?. Anyways, we later became friends of theirs and somehow involved in the whole mess ourselves. Fun. (*Then*, we called them out privately, lol).
The reveal never happened. They broke up before, and only years after the fact was ever there any admission to any relationship even happening at all. Even then it was barely a shadow of the truth.
I will also say that even though they eventually became more famous and wealthy than VM, they didn't start out this way. They were young and poor kids, thrown together. They were also not very (and still not) recognizable out and about in public, either together or separately. They were known in their hometowns and obviously when they were in the spotlight, but running errands or at restaurants or just walking down the street, people didn't have a clue.
Back when more people regularly commented on FanForum, there were several conversations during which several posters flat out stated V/M are lying about being a real life couple. They weren't saying so as speculation, but as "they are. It's not a rumor, it's true. Period."
DeleteWhenever one of those conversations would occur and go on for several days, a new photograph of Jessica Dube and Scott or post would magically appear on FB a few days later. It happened like clockwork, over and over again. Conversation = the Moirs respond on FB with a dump of one of their stored Jessica/Scott photos, which were always so comically staged and awful. "Here's the happy couple picking apples! Here they are swimming with dolphins! Here they are walking in LA so far apart from each other Jessica would need a telescope to find where Scott is located. Here's Shawn Sawyer standing in between them like a prop."
There were other patterns that became apparent very quickly. The fake girlfriends always changed their profile photos to one of them and Scott before a major competition or media blitz, then changed it back as soon as it was over. Other sycophants would head to message boards and twitter to start talking about "sightings" of the happy couple (Scott and the GF) at competitions, or wherever. There's always photos from random summer weddings that appear, as well as holiday parties. Scott is almost always piss drunk in them and the gfs range from looking bored out of their skulls to, well...Cassandra looking like she hopes her taking part in this will have some benefit for her later down the line or something. That doesn't even include what V/M would do themselves to yank the chains of the public in interviews and when surrounded by fans. They know when a camera is on them and act accordingly. They also know how to use twitter (as do their friends and family members) very strategically and have done so for years now.
They did that photo dump stuff before the 2010 Olympics, but it really shot through the roof after that point. It became (and remains) an interesting phenomenon to observe. Just how ridiculous and unbelievable can these two public figures act and still convince some of the public they aren't lying to them? Extremely ridiculous and unbelievable, it turns out.
@ 7:59, I think I explained the "off" (inconsistencies/contradictions in interviews, watching them interact vs what was said, and my personal history with watching an almost identical scenario I knew for a fact to be true, etc.) I said nothing about pictures or videos, nor am I basing any of my belief of this story on that type of thing (although I will say T did have major body changing that could be scientifically consistent with a pregnancy in 2010). I, myself, do not have any firsthand knowledge regarding VM (that I can concretely remember, at least). However, when you see an almost identical situation in front of you, paired with research of your own that points out lies are being told, it's extremely easy to accept.
Delete"Whenever one of those conversations would occur and go on for several days, a new photograph of Jessica Dube and Scott or post would magically appear on FB a few days later. It happened like clockwork, over and over again."
and
"The fake girlfriends always changed their profile photos to one of them and Scott before a major competition or media blitz, then changed it back as soon as it was over..."
Yes. This. I wasn't around for this time, (although if I had been it might have been enough in and of itself to convince me), but this is exactly the kind of thing that would happen with the other couple. In gearing up to some sort of major career event, there would be a publicity stunt (P.S.), whether it was an appearance/picture or an anon saying they saw someone somewhere, or an article that mentioned a fake s.o. in passing, or a friend posting a picture or comment. Also, if it seemed the conversation on massage boards/fan talk was increasing, or there were rumblings in the press, we'd almost always get something to squash those "rumors".
Seriously, is there an agency out there for this??
:) No agency, but cliches are cliches because they work.
DeleteBull Durham:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeVca9MwDX8
Two situations, one eventually public, one not. Two affairs where the guy was married, his side piece (and co-star/partner/love interest) wasn't. Brother and sister got taken for a long walk. "We argue and snark at each other like brother and sister." "My wife doesn't mind the hot stuff, she thinks we should play it up even more. She wants us to be a hit." "This is the first time I've had a friendship with a woman where there wasn't any question of sexual tension underneath. Pure friend."
These are two completely unrelated relationships/scenarios, real life (well, show business) quite a few years apart. I doubt Couple A has even heard of Couple B, since both were niche in show business, different niches. With Couple A, the guy dumped his wife and married his "sister" "pure friend" and was sleeping with her the entire time he was spouting this stuff. With Couple B, the guy stuck with his wife while continuing to carry on off and on with his snark buddy. Cliches work. Ever read fan fic? That's the language of fan fic too. How often did the madonna/whore scenario get trotted out for Tessa/Scott/Jessica. Tessa a studious virgin, Scott a nice boy with needs, Jessica a ho who put out and used it to keep him. How much imagination did that take? Cliches work. Ying and yang. Brother and Sister. Introvert extrovert. Academic Tessa, and Scott who reads while moving his lips, but he doesn't have the patience to read.
Scott really got the short end of the stick. When he coached, he was adored by the kids he coached. He reads. He's may not be "tutored" in music but he's got a sophisticated sensibility, he's not all country music or Hail the Villain.
Here's something I wonder about: In Vancouver 2010, Scott said if he wasn't a skater he'd like to be in law enforcement. The security at the games was stellar and that would interest him. Lord knows, Scott is orderly (Very. This is something he doesn't advertise, however.). He's downright tidy. Recently, Scott said he no longer wants to be in law enforcement since he got arrested and is disillusioned.
Do tell. We all know if Scott and Tessa were married with a child, there is no way it could be kept off the internet. How was Scott's arrest kept off the internet and out of the news?
7:45 - do you see a connection between the lack of reveal and the break-up? Do you believe they'd have had a better chance of staying together if they'd come clean?
Delete"Seriously, is there an agency out there for this??"
DeleteThere ARE PR firms and publicists who are aces at reconstructing the public images of damaged/less than beloved public figures. For instance, I believe it was John McEnroe, Andrei Agassi, and Charles Barkley that all used the same PR firm to help them construct new, less acerbic public images so they could transition into sportscasting careers. I can't remember the name of the firm, the topic came up in a conversation I had with a friend very involved in tennis and the minute details escape me now.
There are also publicists who are very good at constructing fake relationships to help public figures cover up their real personal lives. I have no first-hand knowledge, but it seems also a sure bet that the Kristen Stewart/Rob Pattinson relationship was created in a publicist's office and always a sham. Then there are the gay guys who need beards. This is in no way related to V/M but I find it very interesting that Mr. "I'll never get married again," I've employed a probable string of beards George Clooney suddenly announced an engagement to a woman around the same time the Bryan Singer sexual abuse scandal began unraveling in Hollywood. There are probably hundreds of people somehow involved in that at different levels and I could see someone like Clooney possibly being connected or accused of being connected and wanting to do everything in his power to offset that. Or there may be some other reason he's doing what he is that has nothing to do with him actually being in love with this woman and wanting to marry her. Point being, there are people who do this stuff for a living and are quite successful, as grotesque as it can be at times.
For the record, V/M's lying doesn't seem professionally done. It comes across as haphazardly managed and more the purview of a bunch of non-professionals thinking they can run the show on their own. They aren't doing a good job. The only thing that's probably saved them from it completely blowing up is that their sport is niche and full of people who know it's corrupt as fuck but are desperate for the public to believe otherwise. That's why they claim the corruption is all the Russians' fault. It's a cover, a way of excusing away something that infects the entire sport of figure skating. If V/M were athletes in a more major sport, they would either have to get better representation to run their sham or it would probably fall in on their faces.
For a support as corrupt as it is, they've certainly upped the ante by proactively marketing a hoax to the public about a skating team's private lives. Skate Canada had two directors tasked to that agenda, both of whom behaved as if it were a legitimate allocation of much of their time. Skate Canada also put volunteers on the job. There is no reason for the public to trust anything about figure skating.
DeleteI haven't researched Barb McDonald's educational background, but Debbi Wilkes has an ancient marketing degree from the 1970s. In this blog's archives are a series of screen caps showing Debbi getting some camera face time for herself in a way that she's trying to set up as happenstance. It happens at the High Performance Camp, where Scott and Tessa are interviewed in the foreground. We're meant to believe the common area/corridor behind them is trafficked by people interviewing skaters, walking from here to there, etc. However, the entire sightline between VM and Debbi is clear. Debbi positions herself in a three-quarter posture in the sightline between VM's shoulders, some distance in the background but still completely recognizable. There's lots of room between Debbi and VM, but not once days anyone cross that space between Debbi and VM. Nobody turns their own faces so as to be seen by VM's camera. It's just VM, Debbi framed by their shoulders, and people bunched on either side, facing away and not moving into her sightline. At one point, a woman backs into the sightline and briefly blocks our view of Debbi. We see the woman react to something someone immediately says to her, look over her shoulder at VM's camera and jerk her thumb towards it, and then back away out of the sightline once more. This is Debbi using VM to market Debbi.
DeleteUgh. Debbi and Barb are the worst.
DeleteVM let a lot of people use them in order to keep their sham going. I'm still trying to figure out how Kaitlyn Lawes figures this is a profitable thing for her to do. Not just her, VM's shams always involve the girls' families who enthusiastically participate. In this case, not just Lawes family but her curling team has to approve and help with the shamming, don't they? These people have lost their role-model status for me.
Tumblr pointed out that in video of the big meeting with Russian fans, Scott slips in calling Tessa "honey." Add that to the list of things that fans are seeing but willfully ignoring. *Headdesk* (Although it's possible it was a bait on VM's part, I suppose.)
ReplyDeleteI watched that he totally DOES NOT say that. He says something to the effect of "what did u get" I couldn't believe these guys would believe that
DeleteDoesn't sound like "honey" to me either and besides, that video has been up for ages, and only now they decide he said "honey"? After months of Tessa and Scott all over each other, building up their hopes? I think some people are going to be in for a short, sharp shock when Ms Lawes gets "launched".
DeleteI couldn't hear him saying that either. Besides, this video has been up for ages and only now they decide he said “honey”? After months of Tessa and Scott all over each other and building up their hopes, I think they are, as always, hearing what they want to hear and seeing what they want to see. I think some people are going to get a short, sharp shock when Ms Lawes gets “launched”.
Delete^^ Sorry - I thought the first comment hadn't taken and then forgot what I wrote :-)
DeleteI'm not sure either way, but the point is still valid - many of them believe he said it, but are completely ignoring the fact that "partners" (or even friends) don't use that endearment, seemingly offhand, in regular conversation. Seeing but not seeing.
DeleteAnon at 7:41 am - I like your wording of when Ms. Lawes gets "launched". I also think that Ms. Virtue will be seen hanging out with some West Coast based Olympians this summer...
DeleteGeez, how many girlfriends will Scott go through before he could be publicly settled down with his real wife?
DeleteThe annual beach-bunny photos are particularly disgusting. Not really because they've shown much (since the Jessica Punta Cana bomb they've been a little more careful when they're on a beach), but the implications attached to the idea of a romantic exotic get-away are gross considering Scott is a married father.
An infinite number of girlfriends. At this point, I'm not sure that Scott and Tessa know how to function as a couple without one of them having a fake significant other somehow involved.
Delete9:00 -- If you're right about that, then they're in a truly tragic situation. Can you also imagine the infinite number of grotesque sham photos their future children have to deal with. It's such arrogant tunnel-vision for VM and Co. to think of all of this as "just entertainment." Yeah, that's how the entertainment world may function. No matter. Real life has a way of making all those things come with a price tag.
Delete9:26 here - I meant their children as in the present and the future children having to deal with Daddy's activities (however implied, they're a source of ridicule from other children and anxiety for his own children).
DeleteAnon telling the story of the movie couple's sham said they were both "people pleasers." Scott and Tessa seem to have that streak. Whether or not they are people pleasers, they want to be perceived that way, and that could make them hesitate if they have the same apprehension about the reaction to their hoax as the movie couple had. In both cases though, it seems to me the celebrity lives too far up their own hind end. People move on. They not only move on from one sham narrative to another that contradicts it, they will move on from hoax to reveal.
DeleteI think a component hesitation could be that a reveal implicates so many people. Media, their Federation, countless people. I doubt the public or the media (who has been part of the cover up in the first place) will cast a wide net and say oh boy, VM have been lying all this time, which means an entire city's worth of people in and out of the sport, in and out of media, have helped them hoax. Nobody's gonna do that, especially when the responsibility for connecting those dots pretty much rests with the media which is already helping them out.
9:30am, yes, they can believe they will raise Little Moir in an environment where the sham photos will be framed for them, where LM has a context and the backstage view we don't ("Look, mommy was right there! Look, MOMMY is hugging Cassandra! Mommy took the picture!"), whatever that may be, but the image itself is anxiety-producing, it just is. The kids of actors know their parents are acting and yet many of them get a little upset when they see their parents act a love scene, and not just the littlest kids. Virtue and Moir can't control what some of Little Moir's peers will say, or what those parents will say. They can't raise that child in a bubble; it's unfair. Here you are, safe among those who know us and love you, and there you'll stay in a protective feedback loop until you're old enough to think this is no biggie.
That's not how reality works.
This anon talked about these people to other fans as a fan.... and then later became actual friends with the celebrities. It seems really far fetched for it to be movie stars.
DeleteThe person is probably overstating things and was more of a trusted fan than a friend.
DeleteI know this is backtracking and not that it really matters (although, I think it was a slip on his part and not bait), but I'm almost positive he does say honey. At 5:35-36, "No... no, Honey. (Look at?)" I'm sure he calls her that all the time, (and even still that's not "proof" of anything for those that are always asking), but it still feels like a "real", let your guard down moment. Doesn't change the any of the facts but think it's there.
Deletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gQzlrqlHjo
On a repeat viewing, that's what I (think I) hear, too.
DeleteIt also sounds like she says, "You look cute, there" (6:38), pointing at his face on the banner, for whatever it's worth.
DeleteNot that it matters too much, I'm pretty sure he says "no, not even" - read his lips while he's saying it.
Delete"do you see a connection between the lack of reveal and the break-up? Do you believe they'd have had a better chance of staying together if they'd come clean?"
ReplyDeleteThere was a definite connection. If they had told the truth, I firmly believe they would still be together. At first, it was accepted by both (saw it as a need to be done, but not necessarily happy about it), but only half of them would participate. Then the other half was thrown in by accident a few times, was not pleased, made it clear they wanted no part after that, and never had to do it again. The entire things was causing strain, so things were stopped and everyone was happier for awhile... then it started up again and just went downhill from there. It was sucky, and I don't wish that on anyone.
Their perception of what would happen if they came clean was so skewed from reality, and I think really scared them, esp the longer it went on. They were both people pleasers and were afraid they would be hated and shunned if they came out as liars, and how it would look for them as a couple, while they "dated" all these others.
At first the sham part was accepted by both, is that what you mean? And by thrown in by accident, do you mean somebody found themselves in a sham scenario and wasn't comfortable, or something else?
DeleteYes, oc, sorry if I wasn't clear (it was such a mess and I'm trying to be vague). The idea of the sham/p.s.'s were agreed on by both, but it was only ever intended for one half of the couple to actually participate in them.
DeleteThe other person was inadvertently paired with someone in a random joking comment, and it escalated too quickly to stop, so it was carried out... except for the fact it was all publicity and no stunt at that point. They we're able to say they had already broken up, by the time anyone asked about it, so all they had to do was to talk about it in the past tense and make up stories about stuff that had supposedly happened... the second time they referenced a s.o. in excitement, and the fans decided who it was. That one was actually attempted to contain more stunt, but there were also other extenuating surrounding circumstances... and after that, that person said no more for them because they weren't comfortable doing it.
"and after that, that person said no more for them because they weren't comfortable doing it."
DeleteThis has been one of my questions. How are so many people and agencies (like media, sponsors) persuaded to lie for them, or enable the lies? Is it the connection to the "celebrity" that blurs all the lines? Are more people than we know uncomfortable but they just go along or do the majority participate completely willingly? It's amazing to me that years later no one talks about having done that ("I helped so-and-so....").
Anon at 7:46 am - look how long it took to break down Lance Armstrong...
Delete8:22
DeleteTrue. When a French paper broke the story about a fix in the icedance judging for Sochi I thought it might be a beginning of something that would continue to be investigated. It's very discouraging how hard it is for any corruption to be exposed and dealt with. I was so happy when Lance Armstrong was stripped of his titles.
8:37 am - I also found it interesting to see that Marnie McBean recently tweeted that she will be no longer mentoring or be involved with Olympians etc...and that she is moving on...which of course is part of her perogative - but it wouldn't shock me that her outlook on sport and politics has changed over the recent years..you also have to wonder how a Beverly Smith feels about figure skating now...
Delete10:46 - it's the entertainment industry. As someone said in the comments below, get a job in the entertainment industry and you'll find out how easily this is done. Performers perform, athletes compete, but off the stage or field of play they're product, and managed like product. It's not a matter of persuading people to lie for them. The entire matrix of the entertainment/sports management complex exists to market and promote. It's not seen as "lying for people". It's, what is our marketing strategy, what is our message, and even in the pre-reality show days, a basic part of marketing/p.r. is stuff that's not meant to be perceived by the public as marketing or publicity. The public is supposed to think the "product" was just out there living life when they were recognized or photographed or "spotted." Some people with no experience in the entertainment world at all think this is "work" or hurts the brain or something. It's not. It's one of the fundamentals.
DeleteIt's easily done in a universe where a fan, such as the participant at the end of the original comments section, thinks the "more plausible" scenario can be determined based upon what a fan would prefer to believe. That's not even rationale. Something is true or not based on what makes you comfortable? A corrollary to that is the tumblr that says, OMG, what if Scott and Tessa ever found out how much we analyze them. Dear lord, as I've said many times. These people are ever perplexed, ever resistant, even though a few clicks googling information about the marketing/p.r. structure of the entertainment complex/industry would open their eyes. It's been in place for years and years and with social media, particularly twitter, it's even easier.
I'm not saying everybody who is skeptical about what the blog is saying falls into the following category, but certainly plenty do. That is people who don't want it to be true. And they think what they want actually influences what is real (like that person down below who basically said "We think this scenario is more plausible because it makes us happier.")
Listen, people who work in the back end of the entertainment media know how fans think.
oc
@ 7:46
Delete"How are so many people and agencies (like media, sponsors) persuaded to lie for them, or enable the lies? Is it the connection to the "celebrity" that blurs all the lines? Are more people than we know uncomfortable but they just go along or do the majority participate completely willingly?"
With regards to my couple, the person was still ok with it occurring (@ that time), they just didn't want to be the participant... but I do understand your point.
I'm sure there are people involved that feel like they still have to participate even though they no longer want to. I guess it depends on who they are and how they're connected, or if something is being held over them... In some cases (not with the couple themselves, but more so those on the industry/SC side), there may be some kind of blackmail or bartering happening.
With those that are good friends/family, closer to the situation, I think it comes down to a sense of duty or loyalty to help them out, or a stuck feeling that they can't back out now. It's too late, they've been there for so much, they don't want to disappoint.
I also think some have to do with being someone select in the know and associated with a celebrity. They feel entitled because they are part of this special and limited group (or perceive it that way, at least). I don't know, but from what I've read, this seems to be the case with much of their community/locals.
And then there's some people that do get out of, but just don't talk about it. They just cease to be personally involved and move on with their lives.
BTW, you can see how processed Virtue and Moir's presentation is going back to 2005.
Deletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nowGB90YdFo
It's all there. He's outgoing, she's shy/intimidated. They have a real "brother and sister relationship". Listen to the music behind the piece, how it shifts when they talk about splitting with McIntosh/Killing and going to Marina's rink. That's spin. They're nice Canadian kids who just left their Canadian coaches for a Russian expat, so they're spinning it. The music is sort of sweet/emotional when they describe the decision to leave, and how they appreciate McIntosh/Killing, then perky, "all of that is in the past!" when the film switches to clips of them with their new coaches. They come across far less packaged than they do today (at least Scott) but they're still spouting a narrative that has been in place a long, long time.
oc
(Part 5)
ReplyDeleteI didn't plan on a another part, but as I said in the other comments, some things struck me today at work as I was thinking about all this. It also kinda ties in with the post title, as I realized it was the things I learned from my situation... and I think most if not all of them can be applied here as well.
1.) It can and does happen.
If you had told me sometime ago either of these stories were going to take place and all they entailed, and that I would in some capacity be privy to both of them, I would have thought you were flippin' out of your mind. Who makes up stuff like this? That's not reality. There's no way someone (let alone more than one) would do something like this. Wouldn't everyone see through it anyways? Do they need to be committed to the loony bin? Still boggles my mind, yet I can see how it happened and how one gets to this point.
2.) Many in the press and people in the entertainment industry not only know about it but can be involved and help enable it.
The media bait or go along with certain approved questions just so they (the couple, individually or together) can shoot it down and give the "truth". And the press will often pretend they have no prior knowledge or inside info. Those higher up working with and around you will help to cover up and provide clandestine meetings, or fake significant others, or career opportunities, or press releases. Usually somebody knows somebody on the dl that can get you what you need. It's like a freakin' mafia. (Note to the reader, take everything in the press with a grain of salt. It may be true, or it may not, even from reliable or high end publications-whether they're actually in the know, or they're just being fed lies by the person).
3.) The entertainment industry isn't what you think it is, or what it presents itself to be.
It's corrupt. Maybe that's why people can sham within it, because it's a sham of itself. Things are bartered and threatened and people are tossed around like pawns for more money. And to survive, sometimes you have to become part of it and play their game. You can get sucked in, with no foreseeable way out, so you continue to play in hopes of learning how to win and get out.
4.) How publicity stunts work.
I've talked about this a lot already in my big post as well as in others, so all I'll say here is they can be just publicity, just a stunt, or both. They all will achieve the desired result. Some just require more work/time than others, but even those still encompass such a small amount of their actual lives. The most successful will be the ones that look like they *are* their whole lives, but only require some friends and family (posing as themselves or anon) to say things periodically/regularly, and a pic snapped here and there that looks like multiple events/locations and many days.
5.) It can start out as something fairly innocent.
It's just a basic and mostly harmless premise to help someone out, and quickly it turns into something so big and uncontrollable the person feels trapped and has no way out.
6.) Sometimes you think it's one person or a specific reason behind it, and it's not what you perceive it to be.
It can seem as though one of them, or someone outside of them is pushing this for a certain reason, and come to find out it's a completely different person, for completely different reasons. We were so wrong... (this is part of why I hold out concrete feelings and keep reservations regarding certain aspects of the VM situation).
7.) People that are horrible liars can learn to be good ones.
They definitely got better over time and refined certain stories to be so believable, it was easy to forget the initial one. Sometimes, they would put such a spin on things that even though you knew the concrete hardcore truth, it was confusing, and you would go back to the original source/story to sort it out.
(Whoops, too long... part 6 apparently coming soon...)
(Part 6)
Delete8.) We really only see a minute part of these people's actual lives.
I'm talking like 0.1%. I used to estimate higher, like 5%, but the more I learn, the less it really is. There are ways to make things seem bigger than they actually are and span over more time (#4). And major things (I'm talking breaking story stuff), can happen that you would think wouldn't be any way to hide, but yet, they can and are. (See #2 and #14).
9.) It's not only possible to hide your love for someone from others, but also multiple shared residences, a marriage, attending events and family gatherings, traveling together, other relationships (friends, family, business).
Heck, even the most everyday things, like going the grocery or a restaurant, either people don't recognize, or they don't report it to the internet. Sure, you get some sightings here and there, but it just didn't ever matter. People didn't care. Those sightings were ignored. (Even with reallllly bad excuses and lies given). They were never outed this way. As I said before, I don't think they were recognized most of the time, so that helped. (At least VM have to be together so much it's not odd to see them together. They can say it's for work or some event if they ever are).
10.) It is possible to care about and be so endeared to someone... and at the same time question their sanity and think they are complete and utter idiots that make horrible choices and the worst decisions.
11.) Puts unnecessary strain on relationships.
Not just between the couple involved, but with their friends, family and other relationships.
12.) People change.
Sadly, those kids that I knew and loved are no longer the same people. This situation really took a toll on them and their relationships. The reasons they started this were not the same reasons when they ended. It became almost like a security blanket or life preserver to one of them, stubbornly clinging to it as the only thing that could save them, instead of clinging to the other one and allowing them to help. Plus, life happened and they had to endue a lot of time apart as well as rough and unpleasant things, both personally and professionally. I know people change as they grow and that's natural. But, they don't have the same happiness or vibrancy or zest for life they had before/with each other. It just dragged them down and left them alone. I hope that some day they will be able to re-unite and that will return. I miss them.
13.) The Rule.
I don't know when this came about, but at some point we decided this was how it goes. First, you can only believe what you firsthand see with your own eyes. (Even if it's a publicity stunt, you are able to easily see through the cracks and how things are not right). Obviously many of us don't have that available in this situation, so I guess the next best thing would be the moments between them when they think they're off camera? (or first hand accounts from a *reliable* source-but even that's tricky because you really have to trust the person, and you're also going on someone else's perception of a situation, unless it's a concrete fact that can be proven). Second, you can mostly believe what you see in interviews, not from what they actually *say*, but because you can watch body language and hear intonations and analyze semantics. Thirdly, print interviews are crap. Anybody can say anything. Quotes can be recorded wrong or worded to make them have a completely different meaning, or the journalist can just make sh*t up, or pull incorrect, irrelevant or dated comments from another source.
14.) That fans will believe what they want to believe, hear what they want to hear and will choose to see what they want to see.
They will ignore the truth, previous photographic evidence, sightings, others first hand experiences, and ever-changing stories, believing the most recent version of the narrative to now be cannon.
(Part 7-sorry!)
Delete15.) Just because they're not on social media, doesn't mean they're not ON social media.
As it's talked about often on here, they are watching and paying attention to everything. It may not be them personally, but a family member, or trusted friend, assigned to monitor and keep an eye out on a certain place, or group of fans/individual. (*Waves*) They are aware of exactly what was going on at all times, what is being talked about and perceived from appearances, performances, pictures, publicity stunts, interviews, etc. They can have fake/anonymous accounts, or use real accounts from friends and family members to promote a P.S. or post "sightings" and "facts". There are obviously way more outlets for this now than ever, and I'll just say I'm glad there weren't this many to have to keep track of years ago.
Well.. we live in a system.. which means that these things are allowed because the entire system is a failure. It's not like the entertainment/sport industry is the only rotten part of the world, I think we have built some strange world with a lot of selfishness and self-interest. Money and marketing, pr, digital communication drive everything nowadays, so the sport is just a micro-part of the whole game, I mean, TS are allowed to do what they do because their system has permitted them to do so, and the bigger system has permitted their system to do so, and so on. Same for MC and their stolen gold... let alone the fact that figure skating is a micro-part of sport industry.. so it is a micro-micro-micro-micro parte of the whole game in which we are stuck. There is one thing in common between all of this stuff: the mass (fans, patients, clients etc) can be strongly manipulated by the system if they don't open their eyes and think with their brains.
DeleteSince the fans will believe what they want to believe, the media will NOT cast a wide net implicating a bunch of people, everyone just moves on to the next narrative without bothering to connect dots -- and I have to agree, up to now that is exactly what we've all witnessed with the VM sham -- why not just stop with all this fake publicity and reveal? The public will love them regardless. They will have sponsors regardless.
DeleteAlso, like it's been pointed out over and over (here and in past comments), good PR can help with marketing all the things VM want to market without sacrificing their personal lives. They can still be as private as they wish without lying. After the time of protecting young kids has past, there's no reason to carry on this way.
So then - why continue the lies and not just stop? Everything I read here says they really wouldn't deal with great consequences.
Btw, what would be the best way for them to reveal and still keep all their sponsorship perks and cute marketing based on chemistry? And I have another question (sorry). How does it change things if a reveal happens because they're outed or if it's something initiated by VM?
"How does it change things if a reveal happens because they're outed or if it's something initiated by VM?" I honestly don't believe it would make a blind bit of difference. I think VM have probably overestimated how much people would actaully care (if that's their rationale for continuing the sham). They're just not big enough celebrities, and even if they were - the public gets over these things pretty quickly....another "scandal" always comes along.
DeleteAFAIK, there are two surefire ways for public figures/athletes to reveal something that might be considered "scandalous" and quickly put it behind them.
Delete1. Employ a good agency or publicist to spin you out of it quickly, which can always be done. Seriously. ALWAYS. There is nothing that can't be spun well by people who do it for a living. NOTHING.
2. Win (or achieve success in some other fashion). I'll give an example from the sports world. Tiger Woods. His image took a HUGE hit after his cheating/womanizing/lying was blown open in the national and international press. The pressure, combined with some physical problems he was having (knee injuries, etc.) seemed to do him in on the golf course. Even today, many years later, a lot of people don't hold a favorable opinion of him. BUT, if he wins another major, that will all change. It will be spun, both by his PR people and the sports media, as a comeback worthy of praise. He'll be painted as the guy who hit rock bottom, learned a valuable life lesson, and climbed up out of the hole to retake his place atop the golf world. People not only love a winner, but they especially love a "reformed" winner or a comeback story.
There is no lie V/M have told that couldn't be properly spun by the right professionals. But that last word is the key one: professionals. Nothing V/M do with their PR or how they've crafted their image/messages indicates any actual professionalism on their part (or that of their advisors, whoever they may be).
In the above conversation, I think the statement that we see maybe 1% of these people's lives is the most difficult for fans to grasp. The *only* know these people from how they are in public, they may have *met* them in public, and somehow it's hard for them to process that, as attached as they've become to the celeb, you haven't seen anything.
DeleteConsidering the times we live in, which have been described well by others in this conversation, I find it perplexing that others think this is too much work, takes up tons of time, blah blah blah. A lot of people are involved in Scott and Tessa's sham. Scott's not sitting at home with his "Things" app trying to work out when he can vacation with his fake gf, date his fake gf, etc. He and Tessa have their own schedule, the shams fit into it, not vice versa, and other people do the set up, including wrangling the sham gf and getting her from Point A to Point B. Scott shows up to get his mug on camera. Even the wedding that Scott attended and Cassandra also attended, it's the work of no time for Scott to slide along the side aisle and stand at the end of a pew behind Cassandra for an instant or two so his mug is recorded as next to hers, without disturbing the ceremony or having to enact a pseudo relationship.
A lot of fans, even fans that tend to believe the sham, seem to believe that because Scott has posed with a sham gf in Aruba, or at a wedding, or at "xmas", that Tessa waves good'by and off he goes for a week in Aruba to fake vacation with whomever. They seem to think the date actually has to take place, that he has to vacation with whoever it is, or actually spend Xmas with whoever it is, in order for the sham to come off. That's ridiculous. Even when Tessa wasn't there, such as in the Dominican 09, there are enough buffers to create an army.
Off topic - but it's always interesting to analyze an event a couple of days after the fact..and how sport has always been about agendas and politics but nowadays the lines get muddled...take for instance the very recent Canadian Olympic celebrations in Ottawa, Edmonton and Calgary...the theme was to celebrate the Winter Olympians by reaching out to the community (ie schools) in all three cities and then have the add-ons - all sponsored heavily by RBC (Royal Bank of Canada)...at first it looks all fine and dandy - but then you realize holycow really what it comes down to is plain and simple - photo-ops and the cynic in me kicks in...the pictures at Parliament...some of them more genuine than others...Justin Trudeau having his personal photographer taking pictures and milking the experience...RBC showcasing Patrick Chan and Mikael Kingsbury together in a car at the parade rather than having each one with their own federations...VM being given the Canadian Olympic Team twitter handle (VM being RBC Olympians) etc...all offset by the image of the Olympians going to schools and talking about their experiences - which is a positive...but the one or two school experiences that stood out for me were in Edmonton...the photo-ops included Scott, Caroline Ouellette (Canadian female captain of the hockey team) and Patrick Chan where they actually engaged with kids in physical activities - whether in a gym setting or Scott giving skating lessons or trying sledge hockey)...then we had only ONE NHL player who decided to go to a school along with another Olympian...that's right folks...one professional hockey player....so much for giving back to the Olympics and their communities if it doesn't involve $$$$...and judging from some of the athletes twitter/facebook pictures - it seemed to be more like a high school reunion with definite cliques....also to take note is that not all winter olympians showed up and some high profile only showed up in Calgary for the parade and gala (ie. Heather Moyse, Kallie Humphries, Alex Bilodeau, Hayley Wickenheiser. Mark McMorris etc) and others who have been trailblazers were not there (ie Erik Guay and Christine Nesbitt) which is fine...everyone has different priorities etc..but I find it neat that Scott was able to give free skating lessons to beginners...
ReplyDeleteI think Scott is going to be a fantastic coach – if he goes down that road, and I really hope he does. He’s passionate about the sport (I’m having a good day today and have decided to be generous in calling ice-dance a sport) and has great rapport with people (esp. kids). I think he would really push his charges to challenge themselves but also know exactly when to make them crack up.
DeleteAnon at 7:50 am - this is anon at 7:35 am - I would have thought that prior to the olympics that post-Sochi that there would have been a possibility that Scott would end up in Canton as part of the coaching staff...now I am guessing that the Toronto Cricket Club would be a better fit with Orser, Buttle, Wilson etc...Or even better - Dubreil/Lauzon...Any thoughts?
Delete8:10. I'd say anywhere away from the Ilderton/London area would be wonderful.
DeleteYeah, I think we can rule Canton out! On a sentimental level I'd love to see him with D/L. On a concerned-for-his-sanity level, I'd like him to be as far away from Moirville as possible....someone should really think about opening a skating club in the Antarctic....
DeleteI doubt that Tessa-Scott have any plans to leave the London area anytime soon. They have that house that was recently renovated and while it would be nice for them to escape the claws of both their families, do you really think Tessa wants to leave Mommy behind?
Delete"all sponsored heavily by the RBC". It's important to have sponsors, but in return these events become a marketing tool for everyone. RBC as a brand, the athletes as not only athletes, but reps for RBC.
Deleteoc
7:35, exactly. All of these people are embedded with each other. The Team Canada skaters root for each other but are not going to call out the USFSA skaters if everybody is managed by the same division of the same sports management company. That stuff is all about synergy. What happens on ice creates opportunity/synergy off ice. Unless somebody breaks with the whole business and no longer relies on relationships for opportunity, nobody's going to call anything out. Except if it's Russian. :)
DeleteI will keep saying this, because it's so huge, and yet ignored by the media. The fact that it IS ignored also underscores the point about corruption. South Korea, in complaining about the ladies outcome in Sochi, expressed apprehension that the ISU would retaliate by somehow hurting its Fed and by hurting its skaters. How does a Fed come to say something like that? Well, if the Fed is an ISU member and knows how the ISU operates. That Korean statement told us that South Korea not only believes the ISU would retaliate, it tells us that the ISU is perfectly capable of controlling how judges, across multiple competitions and international panels, score particular skaters regardless of what happens on the ice.
When the media quoted South Korea's statement, nobody went after that part. They all then re-hashed Yuna Kim versus Slotnikova and Bad Russia.
^And as far as I'm aware, nobody contacted David Dore or Cinquanta or their media persons for a quote. Really? Nobody said "Any response to South Korea's claims that the ISU is punitive?" Nope. Everybody just focused on the feasibility of inquiring into the result and changing the outcome. Nobody went to the ISU and said, gee, any quote about the fact that the South Korean Fed just treated the ISU like a potentate who could lop off its head or burn its crops in retaliation for this complaint? It wasn't news. But then the media will turn around and pretend only Russia, and not the ISU, cheats outcomes in skating.
DeleteIt's huge that no one batted an eye that the ISU retaliates. It's appalling.
DeleteAnd as long as we are talking about agendas, I have to say that Kaitlyn Weaver is proving to be one person who gets the political game. During the Olympics - she attended many different events and became friends with many of the female Canadian athletes...she is good friends with Tessa...and has said kind words about VMs skating...BUT she also knows that she has to be TEAM DAVID BADEN of IMG...(who also represent Meryl and Charlie) ...Jeff Buttle also gets that...hence the go Meryl tweets for DTWS near the finals...and let's it folks for all the talk we have been having lately about the VM narrative over the years and how nobody has outed anyone etc...well you can take the same reasoning and indicate why nobody has outed DWs skating...god knows there was plenty of opportunity from other federations, coaches, skaters etc...so there are many pieces to the puzzle surrounding VM (ie Moirville, Skate Canada, USFSA, Baden, ISU, media commentators)...then you add the bizarro PR VM have...and then sprinkle a reality show and bridal shoot...which both of those I believe are Mama and Tessa Virtue's idea...No wonder there is no shortage of material for this blog...
ReplyDelete8:47 - and you don't think Tessa has left mommy behind many many times? She left mommy behind when she went to Kitchener-Waterloo. She left mommy behind when she began training at Arctic Edge. Mommy didn't move with her, although they started trying to say that from time to time, except when they forget. Whatever role Kate Virtue plays in the care of Little Moir, that's a different matter. As close as Tessa may be to her mother, the IMAGE of Tessa and Mommy is p.r. and serves a purpose.
Deleteoc
Well, I suspect that Kate Virtue has more or less been Little Moir's primary caregiver since she was born. It would be unfair to Little Moir to separate her from her grandmother, assuming they have formed a close bond.
DeleteKaitlyn retweeted two tweets about Meryl. Considering how most of the figure skating world acted, I thought weaverpoje was pretty restrained. Sonia Rodriguez (Kurt's wife, the ballerina) had a weekly meltdown over Meryl, it was disgusting.
DeleteAnon at 11:07 am - this is anon at 7:59 am..I agree with you..I wanted to point out with my initial post that it appears that everyone has an agenda and affiliation that needs to be supported from time to time to please everyone...like I mentioned it appears that david baden at IMG has enough clout to make doors open or close...I mean yes that's his job as an agent - but I just get the sense that when you sign up with him - its team Baden and you support his skaters...I can't exactly remember if it was during or after the Japan Stars on Ice - but he tweeted a picture of Jeff Buttle and Javier Fernandez during the end the Walker group number...the hilarious part was that it was from the selfie pictures that became a ritual and Alex Shibutani, Patrick Chan and Scott were conveniently cut out...how classy...
Delete"Patrick Chan and Scott were conveniently cut out...how classy..."
DeleteYes, and Scott Moir has no functional PR that would look out for his interests, making sure VM get highlighted in similar circumstances.
Yet again, VM have let their "official website" become obsolete. They use their resources for their sham instead of allocating them where they belong. What's most bizarre is that they talk about loving the business side of things, they say they're interested in that aspect, and they can't manage something as basic and fundamental as an official website.
Their words mean absolutely nothing. Like it was said in earlier comments, what matters are the actions, and their actions invariably contradict what they say.
Anon at 12:19 pm - well said - I can't argue with that. Pretty much sums up their whole PR...from anon at 11:43 am...
Delete"Yes, and Scott Moir has no functional PR that would look out for his interests, making sure VM get highlighted in similar circumstances." And that's what makes me believe that a big part of the sham is keeping Moirville occupied. If professionals were managing things, in way that gave VM maximum privacy while still selling what they've got to sell....what the hell would Moirville do all day?
Delete2:59
DeleteRight? Moirville is a big factor. Scott takes the fake gf to these summer weddings and other family events because it's a way to divert attention to the sham and off his and Tessa's real relationship. Scott feels obligated to go, Tessa doesn't need to (fake gf takes up the space), or if she does want to attend, the attention is still off of her. And there's the added benefit of all of Moirville feeling super special to be part of Scott's unique circumstances and if they get permission, they get to upload a picture on their public social media place, thus showing they're a *real* buddy of Scott Moir by helping in deceiving the public. Voila - several birds killed with one stone.
In the end, all it is, is Scott and Tessa being COWARDS to face either their real world (Moirville) or the public as their real selves and stop leaning on spin, sham, set-ups and all the rest. I think they're terrified of those confrontations. They aren't confronting Moirville and demanding to be allowed to live their own lives (otherwise Scott wouldn't feel the need to show up at these events with a fake gf in tow) nor are they confronting their position as public figures and drawing lines: "We won't talk about that.... You cannot ask about that..."
The sham allows them to continue hiding and acting like big babies.
I don't have this thoroughly worked out, but it's clear that Virtue Moir think everything about them is a commodity, including the stuff that fuels their private life -their chemistry and connection. I've said this before - they've invented a vehicle - the platonic partnership - that they hitch to their chemistry and connection so they don't have to use any aspect of their real lives. But there's also a meanspirited, dog-in-manger attitude towards photos of the two of them. The blog pointed out that their book was full of inoccuous "professional partners" photos of them at the Olympics, training, etc., but we never saw them until they were packaged and sold as a book. None of those photos contradicted the sham. Scott sat on his "fan facebook" forever, never ever (but once) sharing a photo of himself and his "professional, platonic partner" in a professional, but candid situation.
DeleteWhat WOULD Moirville do all day? Yes, I acknowledge what anon has said - the anon who has said she's learned that the driving force is often not what or who we think it is. But, it is also clear that Moirville looks at Scott and Tessa, particularly pseudo candid, even professional pseudo candid Scott and Tessa, as its personal commodity.
I don't know, Little Moir arrived, Tessa has a built-in excuse not travel/attend big Moir/Moir-related weddings events. If Scott uses the occasion to sham, the participants feel special, and as if they're insiders, so no hurt feelings.
Delete"The sham allows them to continue hiding and acting like big babies."
They can rationalize all they want, but it adds up to that.
"But, it is also clear that Moirville looks at Scott and Tessa, particularly pseudo candid, even professional pseudo candid Scott and Tessa, as its personal commodity."
DeleteHow is it clear? Plausible maybe but it's nothing more than a theory.
5:54
DeleteIt might just be a theory, but look at Moirville's actions. Like with VM, we can extrapolate from the actions.
Last year, Moirville decided it was cute to share a picture collage of Tessa and Scott's first annual charity golf event. I want to be careful not to cross any line in saying fans are entitled to pictures, they're not. Yet, this was a charity event. A big PR event for VM, a classic occasion for making a splash with photos showcasing VM being attentive to fans, attentive to sponsors, caring for the community. If Moirville decided they didn't want to share any photos, fine. They shouldn't have shared any. But first to tease on the ISC facebook page that photos were "coming soon" then let weeks go by, and finally put up what amounts to total crap, not a single good photo, and in collage form as if it were a 3rd grade project. Why do it that way? It's a way to give the finger to fans. They clearly gave a damn about strategically using the event to create great positive PR for VM. It was much more fun to piss on the fans.
Another example. Scott and Tessa's family travels to all the competitions. They never share candids of these events, arguably *the* professional stage of VM, *the* place for candids re their professional lives. What's the harm? The venues are not "personal stages" everything is skating-related, what better way to showcase the professional platonic partnership? Instead, Alma shared (with much fanfare from family and friends) complete albums of sham, Scott and Jessica all over the competition venues and in Monaco (a professional event - a meeting with the Prince of Monaco). Tessa was treated like she was invisible. That's mean-spirited. These people do not want to share anything of their precious Tessa and Scott. But they will if we have to pay for it (the book). That is what their actions are saying.
Here's a 2011 blog post talking about how Moirville appears to monetize any candids of Scott and Tessa, even those taken from their professional lives:
Deletehttp://dubemoir.blogspot.com/2011/09/tessas-facebook-shyness-is-it-about.html
Scott's family had public facebook albums from both Olympics. Well, moreso 2010, but his cousin had one from 2014.
Prior to Vancouver, and at least as far back as 2008, Moir family facebooks were used to present Scott and Jessica sham material, so fans were accustomed to keeping on eye on the public walls of Moir family facebooks. Alma in particular liked to put the album link on her public wall if it had Jessica material within. Scott's cousin and in-laws would do the same.
So imagine Scott's mom, aunt, brother, etc. touting albums flagged "Vancouver 2010!" or "Olympics 2010!", and not a single photo of Tessa Virtue. I don't recall them spamming the Olympic albums themselves with Jessica, but this was concurrent with the times they had other albums featuring Jessica.
Their Olympic albums would show flags flying against the sky, a crack in the sidewalk, a lounge with a big screen TV - riveting stuff like that. Nothing of the parties celebrating Scott and Tessa's win (which media attended), nothing from the skating competition or practices. A couple of Scott hanging with the family. A few photos of Jordan Virtue hanging out with the Moirs. She's Tessa's sister, so it's not as if anyone was pretending that Scott and Tessa fled in opposite directions the instant they left the rink.
These albums were of some Moirs' experience at the Olympics, but of course, showed exactly zero of the Olympics. And you'd have thought Scott was a solo competitor.
I think Alma skipped a Worlds album altogether. A beat or too, and here comes her album: "After Torino - our trip to Monaco!" stuffed full of Jessica, with Tessa a very marginal presence.
Everybody (fans) knew Tessa and Scott were both there, as Scott had mentioned the trip in a press conference, so of course the fans were primed to jump on the album and see Scott and Tessa in Monaco. They got Scott and Jessica in Monaco and Tessa as a human medal stand. Only when fans were all - WTF? on message boards were a few more shots of Tessa shoved in.
Fans were WTF? because, if Scott is meant to be shamming, it makes sense to pretend Tessa isn't around. But what sense was it to broadcast an album where everybody knew Tessa was present, and then not show Tessa, or show so little?
I think when that sunk in, they added some Tessa photos. It also seemed back then, at least based on how they'd react, that they were a little abashed to be caught being so red-handedly meanspirited with the bait and switch. I don't think it crossed their minds at first that fans wouldn't get why so few shots of Tessa when everybody knew she was there.
Subsequently, it appears they've got over whatever embarrassment, they may have felt over being called out, that made them shove a few extra photos in.
It looks like going forward they just flipped the bird and decided that even when Tessa IS officially present, they're still going to promise photos and deliver crap like the collage. Not only was the collage oddly cropped with teeny images so you could barely see what Scott and Tessa there was, it was all sepia toned so it looked like a muddy/blurry 3rd grade hack job.
Another feature about that collage. It included quite a few snapshots of the publicity posters of the event and I think also a couple pics of a young VM. What the... It was obvious they were meant to take up space. God forbid there should be more than 4-5 pictures of the actual event. And like you said, oc, the pictures were tiny and inconsequential.
DeleteHowever, Moirville did manage to have a family friend post several pictures (big pics, up-close and very clear) of Cassandra at the event. *rolleyes*
For those who haven't been around a long time to witness the patterns, this was par for the course (no pun intended). Moirville's actions have never *not* been meanspirited and many times downright malicious.
11:35 - ugh. Photos of poster and recycled photos of little Scott and Tessa, because Moirville wanted filler, and wanted to restrict what Scott and Tessa they showed from the event. Because facebook viewers didn't pay $$$. Contemporary Scott and Tessa is proprietary material. Stick the money in ISC coffers or no dice. It would be fine if they were upfront about it, but they pretend to have it both ways. An organizational facebook is public relations. It's not a direct quid pro quo. It's good will. Moirville - and Scott, when he had a fan facebook - don't want to have to give anything free. Scott had a freaking fan page and only once, when basically shamed into it, did he publish a candid photo of anything to do with his career with Tessa. Of course he knew the hundreds of fans who "liked" his fanpage weren't especially interested in a random shot of him at a crafts table, but that's the sort of thing he published. That's where they come off mercenary, and small.
Deleteoc
The stunt with the golf tournament photos last year was just mean. I agree with the poster above who said that fans aren't entitled to photos, but, as was also pointed out, the ISC promised photos would be coming soon for weeks after the event. I think as with the bursary tournament photos in the past, people were expecting that it would just be normal photos, not postage-stamp sized images that you couldn't even make out what was going on. It was a classic Moirville "gotcha" thing.
DeleteI think of Scott's Shoeless Joe's promotion surrounding the London Olympics was classic Moirville. Half-assed, not wanting to look as if you're actually trying or actually care, and if you can make someone else feel stupid, that's a bonus. Tessa promoted The Bungalow. She engaged the camera. The owners showed up to be introduced, looking snazzy and professional. Nothing juvenile.The place was well lit and immaculate. The chef who interacted with Tessa was engaging and professional. I don't think we noticed the camera. Whoever edited Scott's piece didn't help, leaving in the part where he tried to correct/direct the camera, so it looked like nobody paid attention to him or cared how he came off. He looked miserable, bored and shifty. The interior was poorly lit and apparently the main draw of Shoeless Joe's is to get a look at Scott and Tessa's costumes in display cases. There were Moirs sitting at the bar with their backs to us, and as the spot wrapped they turned, smirked and waved. The message wasn't exactly "welcome", or "We'd enjoy having you here." I don't know why they bothered.
DeleteCan we talk about that cougar who has been stalking Scott? OOOHWEEEE! What role does she play in this? Skate Canada coach who followed him around at the AGM and then showed up to say hi again when they were in Edmonton. I wonder if they're considering her a candidate for the girlfriend role. lol
ReplyDelete9:21, I'm sure she wouldn't mind being considered for the position. I think she's too old. Besides, that position seems to be filled at present.
DeleteI think the sham has moved on from being a Skate Canada in-house operation....
Delete9:45
DeleteI think so too, except for when they still love to contribute, as in the tweets promoting VM's reality show and a SC publicist writing about last year's bridal photo-shoot. SC made sure they said (coming from SC) that VM were just pretending. They laughed at fans who might think it was real.
From the Part 1 post
ReplyDelete"Look at PJ Kwong, for instance. She knows V/M's real story. She went to their premiere of their reality show of dumbassery and praised it to the high heavens on twitter. It was all about showing the real struggles behind competing and training, and giving the sport its due! It's hard! It's time-consuming! It sometimes breeds tension! No matter that the storyline was 95% faked bullshit, Kwong cared about the show as some kind of ambassador-like publicity vehicle for the sport, the actual lying be damned."
I mentioned a few posts below, but it may have gotten buried. PJ has an interview site that she runs with a guy named Jeffrey Paul Dore. Recently posted an interview with David Dore, and guess what? It's his son. She's besties with his son. So much credibility!!
P.J. was the one who lectured fans that they needed to respect the results in Sochi. She's a woman of integrity who just honestly had to use her platform to get that off her chest. Felt strongly. Meantime is in a joint enterprise with the son of the man who oversaw DW's gold medal heist and the prior competitive outcomes that rationalized it. She also loves to lecture fans on twitter about focusing on the skating.
ReplyDeleteThe #1 goal of the skating world, and everyone in it, seems to be: don't clean up the sport or root out its corruption, because we don't want to (or claim we can't), just SAY it's not corrupt and SELL, SELL, SELL it's credibility! It's difficulty! It's worthiness! That's all PJ does. She's not a journalist, she's a shill for the sport of figure skating.
DeleteI can see why V/M don't care about their words running counter to their actions because nobody else in the sport does either. That's how it's run.
Somebody in this conversation talked about how corrupt the entertainment industry is, and how a lot of people just stay in it long enough to see how they can win and get out. What "winning" means, I don't know. Enough money? A desired career? It's hard to deal with the corruption in figure skating when most figure skaters appear to want nothing more than to stay in figure skating, even after their own competitive careers are done. That means not rocking any boats. Virtue and Moir aren't the only hypocritical liars in figure skating. The degree of their hypocrisy and the size of their lies flourishes in figure skating. The whole sport is set up for it, on and off the ice.
DeleteCase in point: https://twitter.com/_David_Molina/status/476740103466147840
DeleteNot sure "what long but great discussion" means. Probably it went more like this: "you want anonymous judging eliminated? Fuck you, no. Next?"
Anyone else suddenly in the mood to watch "The Godfather?"
The ISU should probably consider adding this to its logo, no?
Deletehttp://3.bp.blogspot.com/_4o85VqhQqmc/TFCKd4XZ91I/AAAAAAAAA-g/AWr4UKqE8uc/s320/Godfather_puppet_strings.jpg
Anon at 11:35 and 11:55 am - jesus - but it doesn't surprise me. Afterall, the ISU did not blink after the Korean protest - so why bother getting rid of anonymous judging...the only way this sport will ever change is if the Olympic Committee forces change...and I don't see that happening anytime soon...hmm perhaps we should ask PJ Kwong to ask her bestie Dore what he thinks of this...what a joke...
DeleteFresh off FSU - congrats on the engagement - Charlie White...I would say 2014 is looking good for Mr. White and can I say it - there is no way DW are coming back in 2015-2016...so can we say that we are going to go for broke with the shippers for the 2014 Olympic gold, silver and bronze medalists...hearts have broken for IK, now DW and well let's face it...we know something is coming for VM...
ReplyDeleteAnother baby is coming for V/M.
DeleteCongratulations to Charlie and Tanith. Let's hope they don't get married near the Equator or Tessa will have to give the wedding a miss....
DeleteHa ha, 3:39 PM.
DeleteI'm a little scared to visit any Davis White tumblrs. What I read during DWTs was an eye opener.
Oh, come on OC - I'm going over to have a look - it'll be a laugh :-D
Deletei wouldn't count out v/m trying to stage a comeback for 2018 after a couple of years off tbh
Deletei don't care how many times they say they're happy with how things shook out in sochi and how they felt better getting off the ice than in vancouver......they're still competitive athletes and they're still pissed i bet. this quad isn't looking all that promising anyway
There's also the fact that VM truly love skating. Yes, there are shows out there, but VM are still young for ice dancers, (IMO) haven't peaked yet, and they love the process and to challenge themselves.
DeleteHas anyone noticed the woman on twitter who is obsessed with TV being pregnant? She's asking the public how she can get a gift to TV... she claims she contacted the Ilderton Skating Club to ask about the pregnancy - is this a joke? Does anyone know? Why is PJ Kwong one of this woman's followers? This woman has 6 followers... why is one PJ Kwong? Seriously.
ReplyDeleteNot sure who that person is, but I'm pretty sure PJ Kwong follows everyone on twitter who follows her (unless their accounts are locked).
DeleteIs it bad that my mind went full conspiracy theory and wondered if this is just a plant to make it look like this crazy idea from a psycho fan, thereby categorizing the notion of her being pregnant completely insane, to be dismissed and not taken seriously?
DeleteNot saying it is, but also wouldn't surprise me in the least... (posting pattern is a bit odd).
It doesn't matter what is said on twitter. Hell, it doesn't even really matter what people say over here. Look at Tessa's changing body. That's not regular "post-season weight gain" (I don't even know what that fucking means and I don't think the people using that excuse do either). Her body is changing as a pregnant woman's does and just as it did the first time she was pregnant.
DeleteI agree 3:46, Tessa's body is changing like a pregnant woman's.
Delete3:25 also has a point. I don't think it's any kind of conspiracy (I think that person sounds like a troll) but those kinds of tweets to Skate Canada or the Ilderton Skating Club are the kind of thing that gets the VM fandom labeled as crazy. Instead of getting anyone to consider that Tessa is looking pregnant, it causes people to want to "defend her honour" or some such thing and react negatively toward the fandom. It does nothing to advance the truth.
Are we sure this isn't the same person who set up the "Heather" account last year and ran around talking about Scott's imminent engagement to Cassandra? If so, her agenda appears to be provocative - see if she can say something that provokes a "slip" and gets somebody to reveal something. In this case, she could be hoping that if she tweets that Tessa is pregnant, somebody will "slip" and say 'hey, try sending to the ISC c/o Carol Moir!"
DeleteI haven't read this person's tweets but when I heard of them (just today) I thought, sounds like a "Heather" coming at it from another angle.
oc
Off topic---OC in a post a while back you mentioned you were going to do a blog post on VM vs DW Sochi EX gala skates---still looking forward to that one!
ReplyDeleteI will, I'm sorry it's been so delayed. I've got two in the hopper and may combine them (one is about the tension surrounding stuff that's true (and no tension surrounding stuff that's made up that people pretend to believe)), and the other is about the ISU decision to keep anonymous judging. It feels like that could be one post.
DeleteI have flagged the gala vids because I always want to circle back to that. It is going to be a post and by the weekend I'll have a better idea when, but it won't take forever.
oc
I'm not 3:17 making a list of requests lol but will you be doing a DWTS wrap up too?
DeleteI think the latest DW news really drives home how sophisticated the media game is. Tanith and Charlie have been serious for years. Have a house together. He "gets engaged" just a few weeks after DWTS ends? Someone on FSU posted that Jacqui White was going around at Nationals telling people about the engagement. I don't put stock into FSU, but that's something I'd already considered myself, so I find it believable. If two ice dancers get engaged and no one gives a fuck, is there anyone there to hear it? Why not wait until the headlines say you're an OGM, and wait until you've finished DWTS for good measure. Make sure you keep open the possibility of a deep connection with Meryl during Sochi, have Tanith fail to mention your relationship while commentating (it would look even worse if you're engaged), then up your Q rating with DWTS. Then as soon as DWTS is over he does the haircut to keep his name in the news, and bam, as soon as DW's names are starting to fade, he's engaged and it's all over the gossip rags. This is how it's done when you have competent PR!
ReplyDeleteIt's quite comical seeing the FSU fans so bothered that paparazzi "invaded Charlie and Tanith's privacy" by taking photos of them at the beach... oh no, no one has ever posed for lovey dovey fake candids on a beach. No, the Daily Mail doesn't publish hundreds of those types of photos monthly. And Charlie wouldn't do something like that!
Meanwhile, there's an article that says Maks is dating J Lo. So much for him ravishing Meryl into birthing all those Ukrainian babies. What, that wasn't real? Of course, the article notes that J Lo is kind of in need of a new boyfriend since she just dumped the old one because he was sexting trannies. So they basically leaked a couple of stories about her and Maks since they already have some stock photos of them together when they performed at the AMAs a few months ago. Easy story to make sure J Lo appears to have moved on from Caspar Smart. No legwork involved for her.
That's how the game is played. 98% of what you read and hear about celebrity relationships is bullshit.
I think the public has been led to believe in the idea of a paparazzi that celebrities are in constant need of protection from. The reality is almost always the opposite. Much of the time, celebs call them photographers and set up the shots, letting them know where they'll be and when. I think D/W are in Hawaii with some of the other DWTS cast/crew, which seems to indicate the paps were tipped off when/where Charlie and Tanith (and the others) would be out frolicking in the surf.
DeleteD/W have a very competent agent/PR team, that much is clear.
Exactly, if anyone followed the Britney Spears meltdown drama back in 2006, that shed a lot of light on it. Britney didn't have competent handlers anymore, so the curtain was pulled back and the seams showed. She dated one paparazzo and invited others to her house to hang out. She and her sycophants would constantly text them at all hours of the night to tell them where she'd be, then she'd engage in weird games like stopping on green and flooring it on red, to see if they'd chase her. A lot of this came out later in court when the guy who claimed to be her "manager" was suing her. She obviously had mental and substance abuse issues (well, not that she's unique in that sense among celebrities) but I'm certain she's FAR from the only celeb who does stuff like that. I'd say it's the norm.
DeleteYou're so right that people believe the stars need "protection." One of the DW fans commented that Meryl must have changed hotels once she found out Charlie had been photographed, to keep herself away from the paps. Yeah, no, that's not what someone does after a stint on DWTS. People who go on DWTS want the paps.
lol i know a little something about paparazzi photos and there is no way charlie/tanith didn't call the paps. not with photos like that and not for someone like charlie white
Deletei mean more power to them i guess, because i guess they're gunning for some media jobs, but lol at fans being all outraged that their privacy was invaded
There seems to be a misconception among skating fans that their favorites are not famous enough to reach "stalking status by the paps," which indicates they mistakenly believe that's how the paparazzi works. It's not how it works 95% of the time.
DeleteD/W's fans are typical of fans of a niche sport where it's easier to get close to skaters (in a manner of speaking) than it is in bigger sports. So they start to feel like they "know" those skaters and that they wouldn't be of interest to the larger public, wouldn't sell out, have good agents who set up "candid" photoshoots like the one from Hawaii, or whatever. It's like they want their favorite skaters to make it big, but when that happens they can't quite wrap their heads around what that actually entails (which is not being "stalked" but rather, setting up photo ops, doing random but not actually random media drop-ins, etc).
For the record, V/M fans do this too. They think they "know" who V/M really are as people and that they wouldn't lie to the public or aren't very aware of when cameras or fan's eyes are on them, don't know how to use social media, or whatever. So it's not just D/W fans who do this, it's a lot of figure skating fans. They have trouble understanding what the line is or where it might be.
Dear lord some DWTs pros went with, and there are people who think Tanith/Charlie weren't already engaged and this entire excursion is R&R combined with media whoring, full stop? The DWTs pros will do anything to get papped. As beautiful as Hawaii is, without a set up in advance nobody is running around looking for Charlie White and Tanith Belbin.
DeleteI laughed when I read earlier today that JLo was "dating" Maksim Chmerkovsky, an article that alluded to his previously "dating" Kate Upton. JLo's image/vanity/ego may have taken a hit if the reveal that her previous young bf may actually prefer transvestites has credence. Maks has a "stud" reputation, so if she can get him, that boosts her image, in her mind at least. In "my" mind, the desperation is showing and she'd be better off just chilling out. Those Meryl/Maks fans who believed there was anything between them might not be familiar with how Maksim C rolls. The fauxmance is his favorite sort of p.r. Now that Charlie White has revealed his engagement to Tanith, Meryl Davis fans might start clinging to the Maks thing like a dog with a bone, pressuring him to admit he's into her. I wonder if his side of the JLo item was to get those fans off his back.
It's the classic fan-think. They think they know how (in this case) Charlie *feels* about a range of topics -- his GF, Meryl, skating, privacy, etc. -- they also think they know Charlie's personal point of view on those topics. Then they add in, *This is what **I** would do and/or feel* in the same situation...
DeleteErgo - *I KNOW what he's feeling/wishing right now* Oh, poor baby.
It's beyond stupid and ridiculous. We live in a celebrity and entertainment culture. Even children can explain to you how these things work. It's ego that makes these fans (also many VM fans do the same thing) think their (misplaced) sympathies have any effect on Charlie (and Tanith).
It's clear that many fans really really REALLY don't want to acknowledge that skaters are very aware when they're in public, very aware when fans are around, and that influences what they do and say, and very aware that fans talk about them online and what they talk about. Many fans REALLY don't want to believe/acknowledge that. I can only speculate that it's because admitting that means recognizing there's a much bigger gap between the skaters and fans than they like to believe.
DeleteI read a lot of fanthink during DWTS. Charlie wasn't around during "A" because "knowing Charlie" he needed time to compose himself. Meryl looked like "B" because, knowing Meryl, she wouldn't want to steal so and so's moment. Or they did this, that and the other because their feelings for each other run unusually deep and strong and so whatever happens to the other person might destablize what the partner is doing, and that's why they have to stand back, blah blah.
DeleteWith skating, some of it might be possessiveness. They like to think if they take the time and spend the $$ to go to events, competitions, meet and greets, and do so repeatedly, they become part of the "community". The skaters sort of belong to them. They don't want the skaters to get "bigger" in the celebrity sense, because that threatens their view of themselves as being a little bit part of the skaters' worlds. But that involves not thinking certain things through. If they believe the skaters aren't big celebrities, then they can't believe that the skaters would be "stalked" by a bunch of paparazzi. But they do believe both of those things, which contradict each other. I think they'd rather go with that contradiction than believe the skaters' p.r. called the paps themselves. The latter demonstrates that the skaters know how to manipulate their media coverage, and are not these nice kids who just happened to get into skating and be successful. They occupy a world apart from the fans, a world where everything they do is aimed towards taking their skating success and leveraging it into branding themselves into more and bigger success/opportunity.
I used to read the Tom and Lorenzo blog often (celebrity and fashion), and what I've gleaned from their posts is that most celebrities who are papped are photographed intentionally, for whatever agenda they might have. Publicity for a new movie, damage control after a scandal/breakup, remaining in the public eye to keep yourself relevant, etc. etc. Those 'walking down the street'/ 'grocery shopping'/ 'running errands' are often staged, coordinated by the stars' PR teams with the paps. See how sweet we are with all this 'spontaneous' PDA? What cheating/separation/divorce rumors? Fashion-wise, a lot of the ladies also strategically position their handbags/display their clothes and shoes to advantage so you can fully identify the brands.
DeleteSo I wouldn't be surprised if Charlie/Tanith's management team were working behind the scenes for their 'announcement'.
"...and what I've gleaned from their posts is that most celebrities who are papped are photographed intentionally, for whatever agenda they might have."
DeleteThat's exactly how it works like 95% of the time. Even the bigger stars who claim the paps won't leave them alone will have their PR reps regularly call them to set up "candid" photo ops. It's business.
I don't know what it is, I think it's a post-Princess Diana thing with a lot of people? The paps were painted by her and the English royals as un-welcomed intrusions, and the reason she died. But even in England, that sort of thing is often the exception, not the norm. Some English tabloid photographers can be ruthless, but it's often a business decision to stay in the tabloids over there as well. They exist, they aren't going anywhere, so stars work with them to get what they want and use it to further their careers. That can also include faking scandals and break-ups.
"That's exactly how it works like 95% of the time ... That can also include faking scandals and break-ups."
DeleteIn other words, whenever there's a reveal of VM's true status, the scripted, fan-fiction TV show and all the other lies will simply be filed under that nebulous thing known as "celebrity PR." Ugh
No one likes to admit they were played. I expect most fans will fall over themselves in their rush to "understand" and claim they really knew all along it was all lies. Poor Tessa and Scott, forced to go to such lengths for the good their family and their career.
(Rolleyes)
Objectively, I understand how the system works. But I can't help feeling it's insulting that VM and their people get away with these silly and mean games.
While that's how the system works, I don't think the fans at large are supposed to know about it. If and when a reveal occurs, it will most likely be explained as a need for privacy.
DeleteA competent PR firm/publicist could find a way to reveal V/M's marriage/child(ren) without having to resort to any groveling or admittance of deliberating baiting fans, etc. They'd just select a proactive narrative where they claim they believed "playing platonic" was the best for their career at the time, come up with some bullshit explanation for why that was (blame somebody else for it), and then voila, problem solved. They'd then be on the record as a married couple with children and everybody would move on almost immediately.
Delete2:21
DeleteThat makes complete sense as far as spinning the lie of being platonic. How do they spin away all the bullshit on social media? Plus that horrendously grotesque reality series with Scott Moir fake-canoodling for real with a real-live fake girlfriend, calling it "hot&heavy"?
Oh, I know it will all be explained away somehow. I just cannot fathom how they do that in such a way that makes them come out smelling like roses. For years those Punta Cana photos will be dug up by fans, as well as all the other lip-kissing, but-grabbing photos. So every time one of those surfaces, the explanation is....what exactly?
The explanation for the social media stuff and even the reality show falls under the umbrella of "we believed we needed to play platonic to the public and we did." It might be a little harder to sell the "we did it for privacy angle" since nobody does a reality show for privacy, so it's better to say "we believed/assumed/were advised this was the best thing for us to do at the time to bring attention to our skating" or some other bullshit explanation. People would buy it. Hell, people will buy anything. If that wasn't the case, nobody would believe the lies V/M tell them NOW.
DeleteBy the way, the social media stuff wouldn't matter or even be included in any explanation. Only the reality show would, I imagine. Because that was put on the record.
DeleteThe only way V/M could be outed against their will is if someone inside the media does it and gets it put on the record. There's always a chance that could happen, of course. Never assume it can't. BUT, there's also nothing that can't be spun by someone who does it for a living and does it well.
Delete"BUT, there's also nothing that can't be spun by someone who does it for a living and does it well."
Delete^^ I think that will end up being THE problem and potentially why, when payday arrives, VM will not come out of this with goodwill. They don't have someone on their team who is a professional PR genius. By all appearances, their "team" consists of incompetent family members and some guy who is heavily invested in promoting golfers and doesn't know a thing about figure skating or figure skaters.
The reveal scenarios described in these comments all assume a competent PR person tying up the loose ends, spinning everything positively. What happens if VM are outed and they attempt to "fix" things in the same manner they've handled their PR up to now?
I can just see cousin Cara Moir creating some infantile collage with photos of Tessa at all those "dates" of Scott with fake gf and Moirville thinking that's all that's necessary. When you think of it, that's what PR has meant to them. What's to say they'll decide they need to actually go hire a professional? They're arrogant in their lack of professionalism.
"Now that Charlie White has revealed his engagement to Tanith, Meryl Davis fans might start clinging to the Maks thing like a dog with a bone, pressuring him to admit he's into her. I wonder if his side of the JLo item was to get those fans off his back."
DeleteI can't believe people EVER bought the Meryl/Maks stuff in the first place. Their showmance and "she's saved him!" storyline was right out of the classic DWTS/Chmerkovsky playbook.
Meryl's fan club seems desperate for her to be validated as a very desirous person. I think it says a lot more about them as people than it does about her.
"They don't have someone on their team who is a professional PR genius."
DeleteThe posts above are about them revealing with a competent PR team/publicist. I agree that if they tried to handle it in-house with the crew they're working with now, it would probably be done badly and could potentially backfire.
If I was deeply entrenched in the skating world, there is no way I'd allow anyone less than a seasoned professional to handle something like that because Lord knows the skating world loves to stab people in the back if the opportunity arises.
"The more interesting thing to think about is how much longer V/M want to play the platonic card and get away with it."
Delete^^
I really wonder if they'll keep it up if/when they do decide to retire for good. I can see them keeping the sham alive while they take this season to have their new baby and to see what shakes out, judging-wise, so that they're still in good sham shape if they decide to come back to competition and need to do interviews/generate interest/generally be visible once more. But if they were to actually retire such that they were to earnestly pursue post-secondary or start coaching or whatever else they wanted to do, it would probably be unspeakably asinine, even for them, to keep shamming, because (I suspect) they'll fade out of the public consciousness relatively quickly, aside from in skating circles, and skating circles already know.
That said, needing to keep Moirville busy-but-out-of-their-hair might mean that VM sham for a long, long time, whatever their professional circumstances.
The reality show isn't going to be included in any explanation either. It doesn't matter that it was "on the record." It aired how long ago? And now it's a show that was manipulated by the producers to make it seem as if there might be some underlying tensions between Scott and Tessa. Scott and Tessa knew that's the risk you take with TV, so they just shrug it off and rise above. Apart from that, it was a fantastic opportunity to look behind the scenes at Olympic athletes training for Sochi and a wonderful showcase for the sport. The End.
Deleteoc
"What happens if VM are outed and they attempt to "fix" things in the same manner they've handled their PR up to now?"
DeleteHow do you picture them being "outed"? What scenario? Internet or a print publication or broadcast television? What exactly will they need to "fix"? The media most likely to cover the story - if the "outing" isn't widely ignored, which is completely possible - already covers them and knows they're married with a child.
If absolutely compelled to cover it, I can see something like "such and such publication says Virtue and Moir are married with a child. Virtue and Moir were unavailable for comment. Rumors that the Canadian skating darlings are more than friends have dogged them since they burst onto the scene in 2010."
The end. I honestly am curious, when people envision this, how big a scandal do they think it's going to be? This isn't Tiger Woods. Woods' celebrity crossed into the mainstream. Woods cheating intersected with the law. That's when it blew up. His wife beat up his car with a golf club, the police were called, all of his girlfriends started selling their text messages to the highest tabloid bidder, and his girlfriends were a bunch of hustling opportunists for the most part, no careers to protect.
For the most part I don't think they'll need p.r., anymore than the ISU needs p.r. The fans carry on about the corruption in skating; the media mocks it or ignores it and the sport does too. It will be the same in the media AND among many fans. If the media actually has to cover it - meaning Virtue and Moir admit they're outed (they're never going to be outed until they admit they're outed, that's a fact, IMO), any fan reaction will be spun in line with the existing narrative about fans, meaning patronizing tolerance.
The fans on their own sites may carry on a bit, but the very fans that are having twelve temper tantrums on the blog saying the blog is lying will immediately shift to saying the blog was evil for trying to out them all this time, and Scott and Tessa had every right, blah blah. A substantial part of that crowd will claim to have known all along they were married with a child, but, unlike the blog, they respected Scott and Tessa's privacy and didn't trash them on blogger, and Scott and Tessa's relationship is their own business. I promise that's how it's going to go.
There's no outing unless VM and the media admit they've been outed, and unless they do it really doesn't matter what leaks out. I'm trying to imagine the circumstances under which VM have to admit it, or the media suddenly decides to actually push them and make it some type of headline news, and I don't see it.
oc
"For years those Punta Cana photos will be dug up by fans" and if nobody acknowledges fans are looking at those photos, what difference does it make? For more than a year now fans have been talking about Davis & White's fake skating and corrupt trajectory to the top and the conversation may as well not be taking place for all it matters. If it's not acknowledged, it's not happening. I bet there are plenty in the sport who read the critique and understand it and if you tweeted them about "what do you think about the analysis of Davis White's program as empty and in violation of CoP" anybody in media or with a public profile who bothered to respond would play dumb and act like the critique was news to them, say something like all the teams work hard and deserve to be respect, and basically just not acknowledge, or say something like "do you have a link?" and basically dismiss, downplay. Acknowledgement is where the power is. Media entities talk to and acknowledge each other, not us, unless they can cherry pick from what fans are doing to support some narrative they're already selling. There's no cross-coverage in figure skating. To anyone who says "But fans will look at all the lies, all the photos" *I* say fans are doing that now, and it doesn't matter, and won't matter then.
Deleteoc
"For years those Punta Cana photos will be dug up by fans, as well as all the other lip-kissing, but-grabbing photos. So every time one of those surfaces, the explanation is....what exactly?"
DeleteThey're ignored.
I honestly don't understand the imagined universe in which fans drag up the old sham photos and somehow they are able to confront Virtue and Moir, and Virtue and Moir have to explain. Virtue and Moir ignore what fans say and do now, they'll ignore it then.
oc
If it all so won't matter, why such elaborate sham executions? Flying the fake gf everywhere, including her in events for photo-ops. In the end, no one cares? In that case, all their posturing is nothing but self-serving. The actions of people with a huge overinflated ego, thinking they're so unique and precious it calls for a sham. What I hate is the way the fans are mocked and played. No one deserves that kind of treatment.
Delete9:04
DeleteVM won't have to explain any of it in public but the stuff will get passed around quite a bit, at least initially. For people who appear to take themselves very seriously, the ridicule might be scary to them.
I’m firmly of the opinion that there will be no “outing”. I can imagine, for example, CBC doing a Vancouver 2010: Where Are They Now? special in a few years and there’s Tessa and Scott at some rink coaching and there will be some passing reference to their kids (the voiceover will make some comment about them being born with skates on or something) and everyone will act as if it was no big secret, because in the skating media, it wasn’t. Fan chatter is fan chatter, it doesn’t “count”.
Delete9:25, clearly they don't need elaborate sham executions. The sham stuff isn't even referred to in mainstream media, and I don't even include the reality show as part of the mainstream media, as, when legit media discussed the reality show, they ignored the "gf". And Scott and Tessa ignored the "gf" when promoting it. This is something that more regular media covered, and they all dutifully ignored "Scott's girlfriend, Cassandra", and never asked a single question about her.
DeleteIf Scott and Tessa want to present as platonic there's no need for going-on 3 sham gfs in a seven year period. We already know that they're not doing it for privacy reasons.
Right now they're still eligible, haven't retired, and are still marketing themselves the same way they always have. If some media outlet "outed" them it could be dispensed with elliptically. Have an interviewer say "you know, no matter how often you guys tell us you're not together, there are still places, as I'm sure you know, that insist you are. How does that make you feel?"
See how the question there is "How does that make you feel?"
We don't know how Scott and Tessa will handle this when the day comes and they do retire. I can see them still taking it "season by season" up until 2018. I do recall that around Sochi there were a couple of references to a "year from now" which one could take as a hint that that's when they might reveal, but we've had plenty of hits in the past that turned out to be just more bait.
The media may have ignored Scott's girlfriend on the show but they defintiely latched onto "Tessa the single girl looking for a man".
DeleteOC, what Sochi references are you talking about? I don't remember anything.
By "around Sochi" I mean in the time frame of the Olympics, Alma said that their relationship was akin to a marriage and "a year from now" she thinks they'll realize that separate lives is not so easy, or something like that. Then Scott and Tessa were asked which of them was mostly likely to be married in the next twelves months. And they were also asked a similar question to the question they were asked in 2010, namely, does the fact that they HAVEN'T been romantic preclude them from being romantic in the future? In 2010 Scott said no, and I think this time said something like it's an interesting question.
DeleteYes, I had the impression they were maybe heading towards some sort of end/wrap up of the sham(s) after this last quad... I know they've hinted before and gone back on it, but between all the talk about this being their "last" everything, pretty much ignoring Cassandra and the way they were all over each other (more than usual) in Sochi, I believe they planned on retirement. However, the silver, getting caught up in the Olympic spirit or feel, it seems like they're rethinking all that... and whether they are going to take another shot or not, I think they want to keep their options open right now until they decide (hence, KL).
DeleteOff topic, but do you believe that all of their figure skating competitors, know about their marriage and child?
ReplyDeleteAre you one of them?
DeleteOC is a fan.
DeleteThey don't write like a fan. Not an elite skater but could be family/friend or lower level skater. But everyone has their secrets and I guess they are entitled to them ;)
ReplyDeleteAnon at 6:55 am - I agree with you that some of the male radio hosts and Michael Lansberg of TSN were definitely douchebags...but then again Lansberg has been an idiot for a very long time...
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/_david_molina/status/477130320022876161
ReplyDeleteCheck out how South Korea's federation voted. That's so sketchy.
Bev Smith weighs in on the issue:
Deletehttp://bevsmithwrites.wordpress.com/2014/06/13/south-korea-embraces-anonymous-judging-at-isu-congress/
I think Smith's piece is a huge whiff and rather toothless.
DeleteIt starts off decently. Here, it seems like she's going in the right direction: "I guess we have to take their word for it. We don’t know what this acceptable corridor was. Nor do we know which countries created it."
But then she basically stops it there. There's no "why isn't the 'what is acceptable' available to the public?" question or anything remotely related to that. It's mostly just "back during the 6.0 days there would be a judge who would say whether a result was correct or not."
Then she notes Russia has been served well by anonymous judging. So, she basically plays the evil Russia is EVIL! card there, but makes no mention of those other feds who voted against anonymous judging possibly (likely) benefiting from it as well. Like, you know…the USFSA and Meryl Davis and Charlie White, for instance. Did she or did she NOT write earlier pieces questioning D/W's scores? Have we entered into some kind of time warp? She makes it seem like "see, even Russia wants this!" As though Russia is the only notable offender. Please.
Then there's this: "Perhaps some members just don’t understand the implications? Do they want to keep judges’ scores secret? Why? What could possibly by in it for South Korea, especially with the 2018 Olympics coming up?"
South Korea has the 2018 Olympics. HELLO. Ask and answer your own question there, Bev? You think there's no reason the South Korean fed wouldn't want to piss off the ISU and/or take advantage of the fact they'll have home-ice advantage (both for short track and figure skating) in Pyeongchang? If you're going to ask the question, then try to play the tape through to the end. If not, don't ask the question.
Then, this: "The nobleness of their petition regarding the women’s event at the Olympics – at first they didn’t ask for medals to be reassigned, only that results be investigated “immediately and transparently” to ensure fair judging in the future – takes a bit of a hit, knowing that they want anonymous judging. It’s hard to comprehend. Open judging could have helped their case against the results of the Sochi event."
You know what's also hard to comprehend, Bev? That you left out the part about how South Korea publicly claimed they were worried the ISU might punish their skaters as retribution for the complaint being filed in the first place. When you take THAT into the equation, Korea suddenly changing their minds about the issue seems kind of, oh…I don't know…not just questionable, but HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS?
In the paragraph where she mentions the spirit of ethics…she starts moving in the right direction again (although she's crawling), but then alas…that dies again as she goes back to blaming it all on…you guessed it…RUSSIA.
NO SHIT. People who write about this sport can't make connections, or pretend they can't. Why would South Korea vote for anonymity? To kiss ass, maybe, since they were already quaking in their boots about ISU retaliation for their ladies event complaint?
DeleteI await Smith's explanation for how RUSSIA got all the judges to overlook Davis and White's crap non-skating and non-dancing.
Or maybe South Korea knew the complaint wouldn't garner a results change but said what they did about retribution as a political move?
DeleteSmith's piece is so toothless because there's no logical follow-through to any of it. She's criticizing the Russians for playing politics and the ISU for going along with it but then can't figure out why the South Koreans wouldn't have some stake in playing politics too, even after she basically lays out how that's the way to win in the sport?
I'm unclear on what message she's trying to get across in this piece.
Her message is quite clear to me: "I'm a 'journalist' who wants to look serious, but I don't want to lose access, so I'm going to make like I'm doing some serious analysis when actually all I'm writing is bullshit. The figure skating audience is stupid anyway, so it won't notice."
DeleteExcept for Tuna, South Korea is not a major federation, like the US or Canada. In the skating universe it's better not to rock any boats. If they knew the majority were voting for anonymous judging they most probably feel obligated to go along.
ReplyDeleteSorry. Yuna not Tuna. Lol
DeleteI think the discussion here helps show that fans who don't know how Scott and Tessa pull this off are coming at this from the wrong angle. Scott and Tessa aren't sneaking around. They're working inside a system that facilitates all of it. Fans seem to think that system (fellow skaters, media, etc.) would EXPOSE them. No, the system is working it for them. It's all packaged as privacy protection, and apparently anything that contradicts that doesn't have to be acknowledged.
ReplyDeleteIt was speculated that the reality show was a risk that took the sham mainstream, but as it turned out, that speculation was wrong. Scott and Tessa shammed on the reality show, and all of the media that covered the reality show ignored the Cassandra parts. That's not an accident. That's pre-arranged. A man has a girlfriend that he's displaying on a reality show and via social media, a man makes a big to do about fans having erroneous ideas about himself and his partner, and nobody can bring up the fact that his girlfriend had a major co-starring role in his "documentary"? Nobody says to them, "Fans really want you together, despite the fact that Cassandra, your girlfriend, was a co-star in your reality show. How does she feel about that."
Cassandra? What's a Cassandra? It was the same with Jessica. Look at who Jessica was (face slash girl, teammate, her partner is her ex-boyfriend, going for an Olympic medal same Olympics as Scott, public profile in her own right, blah blah) - no mainstream media brought it up. That's not incidental.
Scott and Tessa don't have to 'explain' anything that is not acknowledged or addressed in mainstream media, and mainstream media is not acknowledging or addressing anything Scott and Tessa don't want out there. This is helped along by it being a niche sport. In a bigger sport, there can be one segment of the media that is enabling a situation, and another segment, or individual, that calls it out. Here, everybody's on the same page. Anybody who'd call it out isn't following along and has no idea what's going on.
" think most people in the sport find it ridiculous that fans even try to have a voice, even about the sport itself, and if there was a way to co-opt all of the internet so that only media could control what was said, it would happen. Not acknowledging what's said, then making UP what's said is the next best thing.
DeleteOnly if figure skating were a bigger sport, more widely covered, would an unexpected "outing" of Scott and Tessa be some sort of p.r. challenge. "
Ding ding ding! Finally someone has it right. The other dot to connect is that the ISU NEVER wants figure skating to be a bigger sport. It's big enough as it is, thank you very much.
That's something that the fans also don't recognize. The ISU doesn't want this to be a real sport, with a huge audience. This is a sport for the elite and super rich -- a group of people who are used to having rules bent for them. People who try to compete honestly (like Navarro and Bommentre, for example) will hit a ceiling that they will never be able to pass. People who reach high levels know what the game is, and if they are allowed to play. If they can play, that's because they've got their own secrets/favors they need protected or given.
When were Navarro and Bommentre ever held back? They had a fun, audience-friendly style but were hampered by their limitations in both skating and dancing. People confuse what they like with what the judges should reward, it's not the same thing.
DeleteI think most people in the sport find it ridiculous that fans even try to have a voice, even about the sport itself, and if there was a way to co-opt all of the internet so that only media could control what was said, it would happen. Not acknowledging what's said, then making UP what's said is the next best thing.
ReplyDeleteOnly if figure skating were a bigger sport, more widely covered, would an unexpected "outing" of Scott and Tessa be some sort of p.r. challenge. Even if they're outed, nobody in the media OR in figure skating has to acknowledge that they were, or follow up on it, so really, it's all on their terms no matter what scenario we hypothesize.
Nobody in the sport is going to expose Scott and Tessa, as others in the sport work the same game for different ends. Davis White worked media complicity for their gold. Tanith took her relationship with Charlie on the dl. Nobody in the media ever questioned why Tanith was commentating/evaluating her boyfriend/fiance's team vis a vis Scott and Tessa, or questioned if she should be assigned to competitions where Scott and Tessa competed against her live-in boyfriend. Nobody NOW is even mentioning that Davis White played up their soul-to-soul connection all season only for White to come out as engaged to Tanith the second his gig with DWTs concluded. If any of us think Charlie White actually proposed to Tanith in Hawaii, instead of it being a done deal way before, we need our heads examined. It's already been pointed out that if anyone thinks the paps found them, instead of being summoned, we also need our heads examined. Davis White's professional starmaking machinery is as big a racket as Scott and Tessa's platonic passion, as it is built on an Olympic medal they flat out stole and flat out didn't earn. Nobody in the media is connecting those dots.
Look at all the more minor "secrets" out there. When Moore-Towers Moscovitch split, suddenly it leaked on fsu that Moore-Towers had been shopping for non-Moscovitch partners as far back as a couple of years ago. Did a try-out with Ian Beharry. I don't know this for a fact, but this is the account of someone on fsu I find credible, not least because a) fsu tried to shut it down and b) because they claim Beharry's sister as their source, claim she's given the green light to report it, and that sounds like just the kind of clusterfuck political/personal/drama mess that we find in figure skating when somebody's ambitions collides with their loyalty/integrity.
The fact that the entertainment media personalities interviewing Scott and Tessa about the reality show never mentioned Cassandra just highlights how much these interviews depend upon pre-interview material provided by the subjects of the interview. It's a safe bet that most of those who interviewed Scott and Tessa about their reality show never saw it, and relied on material/talking points provided by either Barb MacDonald or other people responsible for interview prep.
ReplyDeleteDuring the Olympic weeks I did see two print reports on VM that mentioned Cassandra by name as Scott's girlfriend. What's interesting is these weren't interviews, just articles of these writers' opinions about skating/VM and it was evident they were using the show as a basis for factual information. So there are journalists who believed the show. Maybe by now they've learned differently but during Sochi, they believed VM's narratives.
ReplyDeleteSince then, since it looks like Cassandra is already history, no one needs to follow up on those articles. And of course, in the myriad interviews done the days after Sochi, no one mentioned Cassandra by name, even though there were social media pictures showing she had been in Sochi with the Moirs.
^In the theatre that is Scott and Tessa's "interviews", they're asked about their relationship. As in 2010, they're not asked if they're a couple. It's "acknowledged" that "everybody - fans" want them to be or wish they were a couple, and then the interviewer affirms that they're not, and Scott and Tessa nod; often as not the nod is towards what the fans want as much as confirming they're platonic. Ben Mulroney went on for freaking ever talking about how fans want them to be together, or assume they're together, and wanted to know how Scott copes. Lord knows I've said this plenty but it doesn't register with fans. Jessica Dube was a high profile figure skater in Canada. She was famous for having her cheek slashed by her partner/ex-boyfriend. She aggressively promoted her "relationship" with Scott on her facebook, where she had countless fans as friends. Right there you have a famous pairs skater who is still skating with the man she (implicitly) dumped for another teammate, a famous ice dancer. Meantime, the ice dancer is with a woman everybody wants him to marry. How does Jessica cope with it all?
ReplyDeleteThe Scott/Tessa interview games could have come to a full stop simply by repeating that he's with Jessica. And what a story that is, except it's fake, and that's why it wasn't brought up. Ben Mulroney is throwing a billion hypothetical scenarios at Scott and never once does Scott say "I actually do have a girlfriend that I've been with for three years." and never once did Ben Mulroney say, "But in fact, you are dating a figure skater, but it's not Tessa. It's Jessica Dube, whom we all remember as the [face slash]. She used to date her partner, Bryce. Doesn't this get awkward for you guys? How do you manage it?"
Nothin. Jessica who. Just as, in the theatre of interviews, Scott and Tessa can discuss the reality show and never once acknowledge a putative girlfriend was prominant in every episode as his girlfriend he was snuggling and cuddling with. Nobody said - how do you think fans reacted when they saw you getting cozy with your girlfriend? Did you worry that would disappoint them? No answer from Scott saying, they're probably a little disappointed but we wanted this show to be the real us, a fly on the wall, and that's part of who I am.
It doesn't matter what is out there - a reality show or an "outing". For it to count, it has to be acknowledged. Nobody is going to acknowledge it without Scott and Tessa's permission.
To piggy back on this train of thought, and also some others upthread, I initially imagined them someday getting reamed by the press/public/fans for this entire thing. The more I read and think about it, I agree that they won't.
DeleteIf they were American, I think there might perhaps be a little more, "buzz", I guess is the word, due to the nature of tabloids and paparazzi. However, Canada is fortunate to have laws, which will eliminate the type of press that could potentially out them or harm them/their reputation. The media that would report this kind of thing (if someone were to step outside and try to make it a big story), either already know and would protect, or wouldn't care enough and not see it as newsworthy.
I think whenever they decide they're done, they'll just not talk about it and live out their real lives as they have been, like nothing was ever any different. If the press already know, and the entire skating world knows, and everyone around them knows, it will be a piece of cake to just ease into it. If all the sudden they've got another kid, who cares? They already have one. It doesn't make it any more fantastical. If they do any interviews, I agree the past just won't be discussed. The questions will pertain to the present. If the the past is brought up, it will be asked and answered in reality, as if there was never anything else.
When (or if, but hopefully when) this all happens there will be a few different groups of people that may have some sort of reaction. The general public, who either won't care, or just assumes they're already together and won't bat an eye when they talk about their relationship/family. Those who watched the show casually, but won't think or care about how timelines fit, or that there were inconsistencies. Then there's the internet fans, which I think is actually a really small number in the grand scheme of things. Of those, some of them already know. Those that don't and have been persistent in buying the platonic crap, will fall into one of two groups... those who will be surprised, but then just so happy they're together and accept it all for whatever rationale they use to explain it to themselves... and those that will be mad and just leave. Sure, you may have a (literal) handful that will spout off angrily on tumblr or twitter, or some message board, but it's not like they have any power over the media or will change the fan's minds who have decided to stick around. Then they'll eventually fall into one of those two categories themselves.
4PM - pretty much. I've said before that I believe in karma, and that what they're doing is wrong, but I think that's a long game, just as it's a long game with figure skating. However it bites them in the ass, it's not necessarily going to be in some sweeping, dramatic fashion. That aside, a couple of times they've joked about a "tell all." A "tell all" is an odd thing to even joke about for people who claim they're transparent and genuine. So, while I think your outline is about how it will play out, I do wonder if in the back of their minds they don't foresee also capitalizing on a reversal, and may actually do a "tell all." I'd love to be spared, because if past is precedent, any "tell all" will protect the "guilty" (Moirville, the culture of figure skating, Skate Canada, the ISU) and scapegoat the powerless (the fans, their coach).
Delete4PM, does Canada not have tabloids? Can you elaborate on the laws?
DeleteNot 4PM but...
DeleteCanada has strict libel laws, especially compared to the US. Canadian tabloids exist as celebrity promotion vehicles and nothing more.
This article is about Rob Ford but does a good job of showing what it's like to be a Canadian journalist:
http://thewalrus.ca/the-story-behind-the-rob-ford-story/
Thanks. That actually sheds some light on why Canada was so hesitant to call out DW and Rettstatt as well (obviously there are also political ISU reasons there).
DeleteSkimming through some stuff about Canadian libel law, it looks like truth is an absolute defense there, as it is in the US. The difference seems to lie in the burden of proof: in the US, when a public figure is the plaintiff, they need to prove that the defendant published it knowing it was false or in reckless disregard for whether it was true or false; in Canada, the defendant has the burden of proving what they published was true. The article points out this can be difficult if one's sources are anonymous or unavailable. But since VM are married and do have a child, why would they be concerned about libel? If VM sued, the defendant could easily subpoena their marriage records and their child's birth records. That would all come out in discovery.
With stories like these, other outlets can cover the story that's being told. All over Canadian journalism, it can be reported that the Toronto Star is engaged in a dispute with Mayor Ford and his people over whether or not Mayor Ford is an alcoholic/drug addict. Mayor Ford isn't coming out on the winning end of that story. With him, all it took was the Toronto Star making the effort. All of the other outlets only had to describe what the Toronto Star was doing vis a vis Mayor Ford, and thereby the story gets widely circulated. They do other arms' length things in the guise of simply covering the Toronto Star's coverage of Ford. Get anon quotes saying Ford IS a drunk and an addict, but geez, the Star would be hard pressed to say so under current laws. That sort of end run gets the story out. It's a basic.
DeleteI don't see Scott and Tessa getting into that sort of situation. They're married. If a major outlet goes after them saying they are, there's really no pushback. I doubt a major outlet will do so.
oc
"But since VM are married and do have a child, why would they be concerned about libel? If VM sued, the defendant could easily subpoena their marriage records and their child's birth records. That would all come out in discovery. "
DeleteYes. But it's sort of overly theatrical to imagine it would ever get that far. Take the blog. There was one lawsuit where a court ordered google to reveal the identity of the owner of the "Skanks in New York" blog, as a model who was maligned in that blog was suing for defamation. As I read the decision, the blog was flat out calling the model sexually promiscuous, and the model claimed it hurt her modeling career. The judge's order that google provide the blogger's name was and is controversial, but it's also true that sexual promiscuity isn't something you can safely establish in, say, discovery.
With google, the first step to removing an inconvenient blog is to get google to take it down for TOS violation. If it's not in violation, then one can go to court and ask the court to get google to take down the blog. In Virtue and Moir's case, they'd have to find a basis for this request other than 'we're not married with a child and the blog says we are', because they ARE married with a child, and that's the first fact that would be established on the record in such a case.
."I'd love to be spared, because if past is precedent, any "tell all" will protect the "guilty" (Moirville, the culture of figure skating, Skate Canada, the ISU) and scapegoat the powerless (the fans, their coach)."
DeleteIt's more than amusing to watch Scott set-up for the next girlfriend, if indeed K. Lawes is it and all indications point that way. Starting immediately after Sochi he began dropping "curling" and "the curlers" in interviews. Then she makes an Ilderton visit plus there are tweets claiming they've been seen together... By now, the fandom recognizes the patterns and knows what to expect.
I hope VM spare us any tell-all that puts this on the fans. We're all watching these not-subtle-at-all maneuverings and it's our fault? Please. I don't see anyone being less than respectful in all the interviews and meet&greets they've had since Sochi. And yet, there's Scott, "working it" to establish a new girlfriend (and who believes that by now? No one. *Rolleyes*) and dump on the fans a new truckload of disgusting lies. The fans are respectful and nice, and this is how VM pay them back.
The shipping and fanfictions on tumbler? Eh - all celebrities have a group of fans who are into that, it's not unique to VM and the entertainment world knows to ignore that. They are not representative of the mainstream (adult) fans.
They know we know the patterns. They know we know these girls are props. But they *still* go through all the contortions of pretending Scott simply cannot be with Tessa and also simply *cannot* be without a girlfriend (as if he were a horny high-school kid).
Yeah Scott, tell us all about how the fans made you fork out $$$ to get the girlfriend to all sorts of events plus some beach halfway around the world. The fans made you pose with your shirt off. The fans made you kiss and canoodle some girl who isn't your wife. Oh, and you got lucky too, you also managed to get in some butt-grabbing. Yeah, this is all on the fans. Uh-huh.
A tell-all? Spare us. We've already had years of lies, we don't need more down the line.
lmao like their coach is sooooooo powerless and innocent
Delete@11:59, it's rather obvious the "powerless" description bestowed upon their coach in OC's comment at 5:18 is in reference to the decision to create fake sham relationships and sell the "platonic passion" crap to the public. Unless you believe Marina Zoueva was a driving force behind that decision, I'm pretty sure you misread the intent of that post. And if so, surprise, surprise.
DeleteZoueva is one of the few people in V/M's entourage who always punted on the "platonic" question. That is, when she wasn't totally rolling her eyes at it, making comments that all but blew the storyline of a platonic V/M relationship to hell because it always ran counter to what she was choreographing for them, which was taking the real V/M and channeling it into their programs.
To do a "tell all" in which she is blamed for that kind of decision, which is the point of the hypothetical comment, would make no sense and render her a scapegoat.
Yes, I was talking about sham and sham-related blame-assignment, but I also love how we've got the ISU, Skate Canada and the USFSA and the media in collusion but somehow Marina is to blame, or could have brought this to a halt without damaging her own business. Scott and Tessa can't even call anything out on their own behalf. They can't even say they're better than DW. If Scott wants to talk about better skating, he has to use Patrick Chan as a surrogate for him and Tessa. Marina can buck the ISU's narrative and not get any pushback. She's much more powerful than the Korean Fed. NOBODY IN SKATING except the evil Russians said that VM were better. NOBODY. Not their Fed. Not their teammates. Shit, Piper Gilles was actively rooting on Davis White. The Marina fixation is absurd.
DeleteSo much for my reply button not working on this laptop...lol..I wanted to comment also on Bev Smith's article and I would agree with the comments written so far...I would like to also like to know how IKs identical FD in the individual event scored seven points higher than the team event. The lack of anonymous judging is just the tip of the iceberg...its the actual scoring that is not valid and to compound the stupid, the PCS is a joke...and as OC has pointed out on several occasions - why hasn't ANYONE in the media ask Dore any questions..in other sports - commissioners are accountable...figure skating...no accountability..now I won't lie that Russia is given the EVIL label...but you do have to admit that Russia at the Olympics in figure skating was given bonus points from Plushenko's PCS, IK and BS inflation in ice-dance...it was not blatant to the casual viewer but as someone on FSU mentioned the scoring at the Olympics appeared to be predetermined - based on an ordinal system - rather than how COP was suppose to be used. I also think that Russia was extremely smart in hosting the 2011 Worlds in Moscow due to the what happened in Japan...it was the only country willing to host on short notice - otherwise there would have not been a 2011 Worlds...Russia reminded the ISU of this during the Olympics...and count me in as not a fan of the team event...which at these games definitely influenced how the individual events were judged...
ReplyDeleteso if I had four basic questions for Beverly, it would be:
- Why were the judges for the Olympics chosen back in October - November?
- Why in PCS scoring do the ranges not vary more than 1 point...
- How come in ice-dance why isn't video-analysis used to compare teams on a side by side comparison..
- Was there a non-disclosure form for all FS commentators to never critize DW
And if you think the Russians are the big evil...at least they have skating skills and were slightly gifted at the Olympics...DW basically bought the WHOLE quad....one was a one time shoplifter and the other was like a Wall Street trader - with a plytheora of inside information...the Godfather analogy comes to mind...
Interesting read about how paparazzis work: http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/attack-of-the-paparazzi-20140417
ReplyDeleteCompare and contrast with how Tom Cruise's legendary ex-publicist managed his image: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/pat-kingsley-finally-talks-tom-664535
There are fascinating echoes of VM's PR in both articles, especially when the talk turns to 'access'.
Happy Fathers Day Scott.
ReplyDeleteLOL! I hope that Tessa and his 1.5 children made his day special.
DeleteSo, in the ten days since the Olympic champions parade in Calgary, Tessa and Scott have not: caught a plane; bought groceries; had dinner with friends; gone to the hairdresser; filled their car with gas; walked in a park; gone to the gym or, done any of the things that most people do in their ordinary lives. They have stayed in their (separate) homes with the curtains drawn. They must have, because otherwise it would be all over Twitter, right? People just wouldn't be able to stop themselves taking a picture of these incredibly famous and recognisable athletes and putting it on Twitter, or Tumblr or Facebook. Poor old Tessa and Scott, hiding in the dark to avoid the white hot glare of fan recognition....
ReplyDeleteUm, I believe they're on a vacation and not in Canada
DeleteThat's what I was going to say...they're recognized often enough when they're at home, so I think they've been out of the country or somewhere more secluded for vacation. Ms Lawes has returned from the best vacation ever, so I'm hopeful that Scott will start putting in those bar appearances again shortly.
DeleteThey may be recognized "often enough" but I think the point 12:39 was making is that in general there are very few twitter posts or other kinds of social media posts that provide a running log of VM's daily activities. The random, "I saw Scott Moir at a gas station," has happened maybe twice? And that's a generous assumption. I only know of one post with that kind of information in all the 8 years or so I've been a fan of this team. They may be recognized, but people don't run to twitter to tell about it.
DeleteVM could have just been out of the country or at home in London, no matter, they've always flown under the radar. What I've seen is the majority of twitter posts informing of a Scott and/or Tessa sighting seem to happen because VM do something deliberately public and they know people will report about it -- and at that moment that is what VM want. Which means the fans won't know about them unless VM want stuff to be known.
The number of sightings reported on twitter and other social media that don't seem to be sham related are very few. Someone spotted them having dinner together in London in 2011. Someone saw them in a grocery store together in Grand Bend a couple of years ago. It seems like there was maybe one other out-to-dinner mention at some point, someone mentioned them being out on a boat during the CNE in 2012, and also in 2012 there was a trip to Goderich where Scott played in a baseball tournament. It's a very, very, very short list of what seems to be "real" sightings.
Delete"The number of sightings reported on twitter and other social media that don't seem to be sham related are very few."
DeleteExactly. It begs the question of Scott's motives in the recent drinking rampage through Ilderton/London, dutifully story-boarded on social media. Blogger and other comments have already mentioned this, that it comes down to Scott being intentional. VM have been public figures for years, it's not like they're surprised or dismayed that anyone would publicly post something about them.
In Moirville-universe, for some reason that drunken rampage was sham related, otherwise Scott wouldn't have put himself out there so publicly. Looking at all of their history, one realizes that is what it comes down to. The only times, ever, VM determinedly carry on off ice in such a way as to have things publicly recorded are when it's sham related. Scott *wants* that public image of himself out there... drunken fool who makes an ass of himself in public and likes to cuddle up to the girls under the pretext of photo-ops. It's cold-blooded premeditation. In their twisted thinking, this is preferable to the image of a married, responsible father who is in love with his wife.
12:35 PM do you have links to those tweets or other evidence?
DeleteOne question. How do you all know that they're married with children? Do you know them personally, through skating, from London??
ReplyDelete^^^ u think you r going to get an answer to that? Lol
ReplyDeleteSurprised u werent deleted.