Above is a link to the ISU circular letter addressing the urgent need to amend the rules about skaters stopping and restarting the program.
And Meagan Duhamel likes this:
Of course, Virtue and Moir. What an embarrassment. They stopped and restarted, just like you did in 2008, Meagan. They didn't win. The ISU has never given a shit when it was other skaters, right Meagan Duhamel?
Of course, one reason Tessa and Scott never had to stop their program because one of them cut a vein on the other is because Tessa and Scott actually can control their skates and their bodies. They don't go full bore on the ice despite skating like they've joined a demolition derby.
Meagan sliced Craig's hand (the program stopped), with enough blood so that her costume was bloody when they stopped. That doesn't happen a lot to other skaters. The blood flies when Meagan's on the ice, though.
Maybe the ISU should make a rule about not being able to participate in the Grand Prix series or other international competitions unless you're a good - and considerate enough - partner to keep your skate blades away from your partner's veins, arteries and other parts of their persons that have a lot of vascularity.
This issue is obviously freighted with other issues the skaters have that have nothing whatsoever to do with Virtue Moir stopping, but has to do with other stuff about Virtue Moir. They're hiding behind this issue because they don't want to address what's really bugging them and I don't just mean the sham, but you know, being special snowflakes in general.
With Duhamel, I wonder if it's being a pair girl who waited for years to afford a ticket for her dad to see her compete internationally, while meanwhile Jessica Dube gets both parents at TEB and her parents and a brother at Worlds in Nice through no financial effort of her own or her family's. Even if the freight was paid by the Virtue Moir families, that has got to rankle, particularly when one factors in the extra and gratuitous publicity Skate Canada gave Jessica even when her partnership with Bryce was at an end. If you see yourself as a hard luck case who scraped and scrambled and trained to get where you are, and you see someone else sailing through hardly trying in part because of favors they're doing another set of skaters, it could rankle. Even if, upon analysis, it's not a really fair or rational resentment.
What's embarrassing? They weren't dinged enough to be off the podium? They won the fucking short dance. Duhamel/Buntin weren't dinged enough to be off the podium. Zhang & Zhang weren't dinged enough to move Shen & Zhao up to silver. Does Meagan think splattering gore on the rink is not embarrassing, but a debilitating cramp is? What's her hierarchy of acceptable health or injury issues?
Not for nothing, I also think the ISU should make a rule about celebrating on the ice before the program is over - another habit of Duhamel's - but nobody seems to find that as embarrassing as finishing with a silver medal at a 4CCs where they won the short dance and are the defending champion.
Maybe Duhamel thinks that unless you make a big histrionic show of it, it's not fair.
I don't think Virtue Moir faked it in 2013, but I think they did in 2011. And I still want to know - what's it to YOU, Meagan Duhamel? Don't hide behind the embarrassment to our sport bullshit when the real embarrassment to ice dance is how it's scored.
What actually is your problem? What did they gain by faking it in 2013, if you think they faked it in 2013?
I think someone like Patrick Ryan, who obviously is unhappy VM weren't dinged off the podium, should count his blessings for the scores D/W receive and didn't earn according to the criteria in the CoP. The hypocrisy is incredible.
Fuck you, Meagan. Moore-Towers/Moscovitch, enjoy your new legion of fans. In truth, I've always preferred them anyway.
ReplyDeleteThis is what I truly love about this blog; the author and the people commenting might rail on Tessa and Scott for various reasons but when it comes to the skating, I think we'll all defend them until the bitter end.
Poor Craig Buntin...I always thought he was a great pairs skater, but just had two crap-ass partners. Imagine if he'd had a good partner, he/she would have been contenders.
DeletePssst, OC - you might wanna consider blocking out the name of the last person to like that comment in your cap. Said person is prone to throwing shitfits. She's done it before and I'm sure won't hesitate to again.
ReplyDeleteSaid person also claims to be a "true blue" VM fan. Way to show it there.
DeleteRemind me to never be on a team with Meagan. In addition to this, she also re-tweeted some of the tweets of outrage against Patrick Chan's win back in March.
I think OC might be onto something regarding Meagan. She's only now receiving the success she probably thought she deserved years ago. Poor bloody Meagan, continually passed up for Jessica Dube, Scott Moir's official girlfriend.
Deletethose medals must've gotten to her head.
Deletei thought that the note was about how the ISU was embarrassed and wanting to referendum (fix) the BS the judges and media pulled about how V&M had a stop, that the stop was legal in every sense and it was wrong to berate them (V&M)...i thought the comment i liked was in support of the ISU being behind the skaters, V&M....i dont know how you all see it....i really dont....but that's how I, Donna Lynn LePine saw it ;'(
DeleteThis is all happeneing but THANK GOD no one thinks you're married and have a child! Amirite, Tessa and Scott??
ReplyDeletei dont understand why people want to sabotage v/m, how people can be so spiteful. havent they been punished enough?
ReplyDeleteUntil they're off the podium and crying over their double-doubles, I don't think many people will be happy.
Deleteim p. sure igor or the usfsa have something to do with this. they're still pissed that the other boring american team that are not the shibs didnt win silver @ 4cc. truth is even with 5pt deductions, v/m would've prolly still havebeaten them. people who were saying that v/m should've have been second keep on forgetting the WON the sd.
DeleteYes, that Patrick Ryan guy is leaning on the fact that the Shibs were dinged in pcs. So were Virtue Moir. And the Shibs weren't sitting in first. I'm sorry that Virtue and Moir are just that good. I'm sorry they are so fucking threatened that DW setting the bar for monster scores no matter how they skate or don't skate and VM getting their heat held to the fire and randomly getting their chain jerked isn't good enough for these people. There isn't a D/W fan on this planet with the standing to complain about scores other skaters get and don't get.
DeleteWhat is upsetting about this is they are basically trying to undermine VM as skaters. VM were dinged. They got silver. What more do they want? It's not good enough for them that VM only got silver, because that still recognizes that VM are good. They want VM buried.
this is why v/m deserves to win so much. they're going to be metaphorically skating with handicaps(no offense to tessa sorry :[) a la harrison bergeron @ the olympics and to see them rise from the ashes to first place and d/w dinged to 4th where they and their non-skating skating belong would be the icing on the cake.
Deleteto have them win would be a great tale of perseverance unlike d/w who have been fed their inflated scores with a silver spoon. the isu may be a bag of dicks but its so obvious the russians prefer v/m.
What's hilarious is that for VM to get 3rd, they'd have to lose 23.9 points. Five points is a HUGE deduction. And then they should lose 18.9 points in PCS? Oh, wait,I guess people said they shouldn't have been able to do the lift, so they restart how many seconds after they stopped? That should be in the rules too.
DeleteIf this letter isn't a shot across the bow alerting us that the fix is in, I don't know what is. Of all the issues existing in ice dance, this, an event that had no impact on the outcome whatsoever, is, after almost three decades, a matter of urgency to the ISU only because Virtue Moir stopped at the 4CCs in 2013 and had the audacity to still skate well enough to win the silver medal. It is apparent, on that facebook, that what really grinds their gears is VM weren't stomped and humiliated for stopping. |That they were acknowledged as good enough to be second on the podium despite stopping. That's too threatening. They needed to be one or more places lower, so DW fans could pretend DW would have won the event even if VM hadn't stopped. It's the fact that VM would have likely won the event if they had skated through that is killing these people, and the ISU is agreeing with them.
ReplyDeleteoc
All VM fans need to go back, rewatch the FD from 4CC and mark the moment they had to stop because that's the moment they lost Sochi. It's so fucking unfair.
DeleteI think this past season was all about "settling the score" from 2012 Worlds, when everybody cried foul that D/W should have won with that BS program (oh no, V/M had a few wobbles that were hardly noticeable, on non-required elements...the gaul they have to win!)Each team has two world titles a piece, setting up for a TV rivalry for Sochi. With the exception of the D/W backers, everybody knows that V/M's Carmen was one the best things ever put on ice. I hope D/W get bitch-slapped in Sochi.
DeleteIt just stands out that nobody wants to talk about DW's skating. They are eager to talk about the penalties they think VM should receive, but they just don't want to talk about DW's actual skating and element execution vis a vis the criteria and standards in the rulebook.
DeleteThey're puttin in the hours. They're sponsored by Kelloggs (Meryl even takes the cereal sailing with her). But are they being scored appropriately according to how they execute their elements on the ice? Oh let's not ask. Let's act like VM robbed a bank in 2013 4CCs.
Man, there must be some hate just below the surface, and I'm not sure VM have really earned it. But for so many people to suddenly spring up and act like this was a travesty of justice when it was basically nothing, reveals, IMO, that people are looking for something. Not anything that's real, not anything they could have to own, but a Trojan horse like this, they're all over it.
that old dude just called v/m's passion and connection contrived LOL if that is contrived i wonder what he considers d/w's connection when charlie doesnt even look at her.
ReplyDeleteWell that says it all, LOL...again a hater not talking about the actual skating...or the fact different dances should have different tones and movements...and not everything should be disney on ice...my apologies to Walt Disney...
Deleteright? v/m are the only couple rn where the portrayal of raw emotion and chemistry/connection comes so naturally to them. the rest overdo it (thats why i cant fully get into fds like je suis malade.)but yeah their chemistry is ~obviously~ so contrived http://25.media.tumblr.com/9faaedbfde81fd84a71b562ea9dafc56/tumblr_mmrrjvSfaM1qc6wwzo2_500.jpg
Deleteimo i wouldn't be surprised tho if that white dude thought their carmen was "too lewd". i mean throughout the history of censorship of sexuality(esp. in the usa) its always been white dudes that tried to censor depictions of women being confident in their sexuality because they want to ~protect them~ or some shit like that. so obviously this dude is taken aback by tessa's raw and hardhitting protrayal of carmen's sexual confidence and female dominance. he doesn't see the passion because his definition of passionate woman is meryl's/anna's/even kaitlyn's demure, lilly-white protrayal of esmeralda/carmen/galatea.
for them (especially for people who prefered anna's depiction of carmen - which was rly weak imo - too barbie-like for me) women shouldn't be raw or confident or some shit like that. thats how i understand it.
Ok, you know what? Does it matter that the dude is white? What if he were black? Would you still be ranting then? I might have an easier time taking you seriously if you didn't have umpteen internet accounts that exchange messages with each other about the same goddamn shit.
DeleteCan we please get back to talking about how Tessa and Scott are being maligned instead of how old white dudes aren't comfortable with sexuality?
gurl pls. go pick up a history book and then you'll realize why it matters so much.
Deleteand while you're at it, brush up on critical race theory as well.
DeleteIn a different blog and in a more relevant context I'd be happy to discuss a topic from this point of view but I don't think it's valid here. This type of ignorance about skating is common across the board.
Delete"I might have an easier time taking you seriously if you didn't have umpteen internet accounts that exchange messages with each other about the same goddamn shit."
Deletein addition, you shouldn't assume that everyone is the same person just because their opinion differs from the status quo or they agree with someone else's opinion and like to reiterate it. you're just as bad as that patrick ryan dude who assumed mary hadda was ms.virtue.
I only assume that when two accounts share the same interests and the same manner of speech.
DeleteDon't have this conversation here.
Deleteoc
its obvious tho even if d/w won the gold [people still feel threatened by v/m. they must be that good
ReplyDeleteYou go Mary Hadda, you go! It's time to push back. It's amazing how D/W fans have such strong opinions even when admitting to knowing nothing except how it makes them FEEL.
ReplyDeleteI couldn't believe him. He posts that link to the isu letter like - finally - justice! Then admits he doesn't know the sport.
DeleteOTOH, he dislikes the idea that actually becoming informed about the sport might influence how he responds to the skating, so Mary Hadda can't post anymore. Although she did, but when he visits his fb again it will be deleted.
DeleteThen he shuts down the convo when he realizes he doesn't have a leg to stand on. He can dish it, but can't take it.
DeleteAnd Patrick's comments along with Duhamel's like are gone. Did you get full screencaps OC?
DeleteIt's the Patrick Ryan guy who looks at the protocols and believes they got no deduction whatsoever. Ergo, he believes the scores VM received - that put them second to DW - are the scores they would have received if they'd skated without interruption. IOW, to him, the silver medal is their rightful place, interruption or no interruption. It can't be that the interruption took them from first to second.
Deleteoc
Yes, I got full screen caps. I don't have the screen capture app that grabs everything on a page in and outside the window, but I capped everything in segments and I guess I'll stitch it together and post it here later.
DeleteAt the time I was trying to figure out why Patrick Ryan said there were no deductions, and arguing that, and it wasn't until later - too late to post - that the doh!! moment hit that he was basically saying their rightful place is silver. For him, they start at silver - in second, and should be penalized from there. Otherwise, what explains him believing they weren't penalized when they finished second after winning the short dance? He doesn't believe they could legitimately finish in first, interruption or no interruption.
Wow is that Ryan guy really that dense? IIRC someone on FSU said that they were out-GOEing D/W before the stop. V/M could've won if it wasn't for the stop.
DeleteThere was a time I would have been all upset about this but now I'm shrugging and OC's post from the other day resonates with me; if VM don't think it's important to tell the truth about one thing (not only to keep it private but to actively lie and deceive to get people off track), then why is it important for the ISU to tell the truth about their skating? Why *shouldn't* DW or their supporters use these tactics?
ReplyDeleteAt least DW are doing it for a better purpose - their skating. I actually have to commend them for making so much hay out of barely top 20 ability.
VM don't seem to care, because if the choice is between promoting their skating or their sham, they will choose their sham every fucking time. So good for them, the sham has been successful (legit media and 99% of their fans think the idea of them being married parents is insane), but their career is suffering.
"Why *shouldn't* DW or their supporters use these tactics?"
Deletebecause its bad sportmanship
Mte. Congratulations, you two! Skating clearly isn't everything to them and that's fine but when posing with fake girlfriends becomes more important, that's fucking sad. I think they've shown where their loyalties lie this summer.
DeleteYou know, I still think even if VM were totally honest and upfront about things, this kind of stuff would still be going on with the ISU and skating politics. VM may be the most egregarious case, but they're not the only team to have been harmed in DW's unfair ascent. The tactics and words might have been a bit different, but in the end, I think we'd still be in this exact place. VM being honest about their personal situation wouldn't change the fact that they're in the way of what DW want and have to be dealt with.
DeleteIt doesn't help that their Fed has sold them out. Their Fed doesn't have their back - to say the least.
DeleteAny skaters, like Duhamel, who enable know-nothings like Murray and like Patrick Ryan (again, as I said above, Patrick obviously believes the silver medal is VM's rightful place - the 4CC deductions/penalities didn't take them from first to second. Second is their starting point, and the interruption should have dropped them closer to third, if not third. Otherwise, they finished in second, so how can he claim they got no deductions? Only if he believes even skating their best, they are an automatic second to DW).
Anyhow, we know that the sport is rife with bullshit, misinformation, ignorance. Skaters, presumably, know a little more about their sport. It's their blades on the ice. Of course, that hasn't prevented a lot of them from making specious arguments over the years. But I don't want to read any of them complaining about legitimate unfairness, or miscarriage of scoring justice, or something they put down on the ice that was inappropriately marked either way. If they want to encourage this kind of shit when they've got some axe to grind, they can't turn around and be purists when it's in their own interests.
I don't know what Duhamel's issue is, retweeting a diss on Patrick and co-signing a diss on Virtue Moir. She's never been one of skating's golden children. However, Chan and Virtue Moir got where they are not because skating is unfair, but life is unfair. Chan and Virtue Moir are extraordinarily gifted. They are each more gifted in their discipline than Duhamel is in hers. It took the years it took for her to get herself where she is now. It's not unfair that it took all that time. It's the hard work making up for a deficit in natural gifts. Not everybody can close the gap with hard work, either, so she's fortunate herself. I seriously don't know what she thinks is unfair here with either skater other than not being one of the chosen, gifted athletes herself. I certainly hope she doesn't expect to get credit for "just about" executing certain elements - the way things tend to roll with her and Radford in lps - while purse-mouthing that other skaters should be judged more stringently.
I'm just going to leave this here but what if all the potshots at V/M were caused by Scott's comments at WTT. I mean, that's when all the hate started (don't get me wrong, people hated V/M before that because of their success and because they are a threat to their favorites. that just added fuel to the fire)
DeleteI don't think any one thing can be attributed to the cause, though you're right and certainly Scott badmouthing the ISU's pet WTT couldn't have helped but other skaters have also made their feelings clear (Patrick Chan, Maxim Trankov) and neither of them are being used as a punching bag.
DeletePatrick is but he wasn't treated as terribly as Scott was and Pchiddy's comments were worse. BTW what this Maxim say? I didn't catch it.
DeleteI think it's agendas - the agenda of DW winning gold in Sochi is the major one. The others are sour grapes and axes to grind. Neither Patrick nor Maxim are going to get jumped on the same way because there's no DW in either of their divisions.
DeleteI don't think it started with WTT. As far as the non-DW agenda goes, I think there might be some poorly focused agenda-mongering, unsurprisingly from skaters who have struggled more than VM have had to struggle. Life's not fair that way - some people get a ton of talent and a lot of life breaks (Scott and Tessa being paired in the first place was a major primary break).
O/T but what is the story of DW being paired? The real story I mean. I heard they both come from serious money so it's kinda surprising neither ever bailed to try and finance a stronger partner, esp. Charlie since he was known as the stronger one for a long time.
DeleteI am no expert on DW but my understanding is they were considered evenly matched, and Meryl was considered a strong singles skater for her age. Of the two, Charlie was, apparently, considered to be the stronger presence on the ice but I wonder if that wasn't because he's the more conventionally attractive. I don't think he was ever really considered the stronger skater by anyone but fans.
DeleteAccording to "who" I don't know - this is from reading/research on the web.
The mothers, by their own account, are very good friends and worked together as a team to encourage Meryl and Charlie to stay in the sport, and stay in it as a team. They never say if it was difficult or not - I imagine not as they stayed together. They did things like drive the kids to practice separately (if I'm remembering right) and do their best to give them breathing room from each other so the partnership wouldn't feel burdensome to either.
I think they were a successful enough young team, which helps motivation. I wouldn't underestimate the mothers working to make them motivated and happy in the partnership, since dissatisfaction can take root at home, with the parents, and catch on with the individual skater, just as easily as the individual skater's dissatisfaction can influence how the family feels. So it's not a small thing that the mothers worked as a team.
There've been other teams where the families are keeping score and almost adversarial, so this is a big advantage. And the other advantage is they were doing well.
One thing is that we don't know how good D/W could theoretically be. If they had been content working on their skating if that meant always being second, or third or fourth or....I don't think they are where they are in spite of the fact they are crappy skaters. They were skaters that had a lot of potential and threw it away when the ISU would give them first place for free.
DeleteI don't think they are able to combine clean, consistent edgework and transitions (especially, especially, transitions, and especially in relation to each other in anything that involves facing each other, turning together or around each other, etc.) with the impression of speed and attack and athleticism they attempt to create now. When I watch their pre-frantic programs, they had nice solid skating but tended to waiver in transitions. That hasn't changed. But now that their "style" is flinging and rushing and level of difficulty has been - but only for them - downwardly modified to mean whatever they do - their basic skating has suffered. So naturally their pcs have exploded. The less the skate, the bigger their pcs.
DeleteI don't know that I've ever seen such egregious overmarking for such empty and non-skated programs. At least in previous scoring scandals the teams were still worthy of a top-five or three placement. This is outrageous.
DeleteOK, I think I may have figured something out. The ridiculousness continues on that facebook post, but the new poster made a point about deductions. D/B received one. So I think Duhamel is probably in a snit about that, V/M didn't get one. BUT...if I'm understanding the rules correctly, D/B got one because Duhamel CAUSED the injury to happen with her skate blade, it wasn't an injury that spontaneously occured.
ReplyDeleteAnd WTF with Patrick Ryan still liking comments after deleting his own posts. You're either in or you're out dude.
The one-point deduction was instituted after people were angry that the Zhangs won silver with an interruption. That deduction was dropped a few years later by the ISU. That they know want to impose a five-point deduction is rather curious.
DeleteDuhamel got a deduction because that happened to be the rule at the time. If that same thing had happened in 2013, she wouldn't have had one. If she is jealous over that, girl has issues.
In fact, I find it much more absurd that the skaters can get a break when the reason is due to a skater error such as Duhamel injuring her partner or Zhang falling on a risky jump.
That's because the ISU is blatantly saying the non-error situations are faking it. How else can it be interpreted?
DeleteI'm 10:32, thanks for the clarification. It is definitely absurd that a break for something you messed up on is going to be weighted the same as a break for a medical issue. One, of course, that is not "being out of breath because you're out of shape" - Tessa really should have more convincing *eye roll* So yes, I think OC is right - it's because they are saying spontaenous medical issues are fakes - unless of course you're writhing in pain - and they can't get into legislating what exactly would look awful enough.
DeleteI'm 10:32, did my new comment go in to spam for some reason?
DeleteDuhamel is jealous she'll never get Olympic Gold.
ReplyDeleteSo now that link has been removed altogether. Guess it got too hot in the kitchen.
ReplyDeleteThis Peter guy is off his rocker...he posted a link about the Shibs' music choice for 2013-14, and he commented that "... moreover it was definitely written for an audience whose importance is higher than we fans; aka the officials and judges. I think this will become more and more the norm in the future, for it should. It will be seen by those dance teams as mandatory to help give them a chance at medaling."
So that's it, folks...don't bother skating, its all about your music choices.