OT - how have Meryl and Charlie improved since 2008-2009?

This is OT  but as D/W've spent yet another season with astronomical scores, and declarations that they're on par with Virtue Moir, I'd like to know how their skating has improved since they were 4th at the World Championships in 2009.

If one looks at Mahler and compares it with any subsequent fd of Virtue and Moir, we can see Virtue and Moir are now faster, considerably more powerful, and have kicked their twizzles into a whole other realm. There is no comparison between the team they were then and the team they are now. Their choreography has become more challenging. Their elements have become more challenging. The entrances and exits to the twizzles, the unison, the control, the speed - it's night and day and they were good back then. Their Mahler lifts look like junior skater lifts compared to what they're doing now. Their overall power blows what they did in Mahler out of the water - they cover a tremendous amount of ice in a single stroke, their patterns are huge.

Of course the ISU doesn't give a shit about that stuff.

I would ascribe it to Tessa being able to put on muscle, train like an athlete instead of using off-ice time for so much pt, which allows her to get deeper into the ice and generate more power. It opens up the possibilities for the two of them and they've taken full advantage.

Meryl and Charlie - same twizzles, same rotational lift (which is the rotational lift used by Belbin/Agosto - so, a 2006-era rotational lift), same dance spin done the same way (once they're in it). Their elements haven't changed at all. But they're getting scored like they've transformed themselves. How have they transformed themselves? They're the same skaters.

What accounts for it? Compared to 2008-2009, Meryl is better at finishing her movements, but neither one of them really uses their entire body to hit their lines - which is okay because they barely ever hold a line more than an instant - and obviously, CoP doesn't particularly care about that type of refinement (not just with them, but with skaters like Yuna Kim, for instance, with a poverty of movement from the knees up). Davis White's phrasing of their programs tends to blur to one note as the skating season goes on; they become more frenetic as they push themselves to be as fast - or at least as constantly busy - as they can.

Marina has created 'busier' choreography that enhances the appearance of tons of action, but it's not skating-centric busyness, and the element execution is the same. They are still choppy, they still generate speed by pushing, running, flinging and racing - and, if we stuck VM on the ice with them to compare - are they really going that fast? I don't think they're faster than Virtue Moir - I think VM are deeper, faster and more powerful with their stroking than Davis White, and move with greater ease and freedom. Their bodies are more open, there's no apparent "work". I think Davis White are 'quicker'.

I have been thinking about this for awhile, but I realized yesterday, while watching video of a Shib show rehearsal, that I've really been thinking about it. How for all the talk of rivalry nobody specifies what it is that makes Meryl and Charlie so close to Virtue Moir as figure skaters.

It's clear to me they don't have Virtue and Moir's power in their stroking. The "power" seems to be in flashy athletic moves, not the actual skating. They push, pull, run and scramble across the ice. Their patterns are nowhere near as huge as VM's anymore.

At -- Worlds 2012? GPF 2011, Meryl/Charlie and Scott/Tessa came out during practice and mimicked the opening movements of the Shibs' fd. Look at the difference between how the two teams move. Of course it's just opening choreography, but the difference between each team's clarity of movement is night and day. Even in those brief seconds I'd say VM are moving more powerfully, more easily, and cover more ice per step doing Shib steps. VM are actually even quicker.

 
The immediately obvious difference here is the same difference evident when they do their free skate. Virtue and Moir are the more powerful and the faster, but we're not allowed to notice that. It's supposed to be speed and power versus grace and detail. But VM have DW beaten in both categories.

In the rehearsal video of the Shibs yesterday. I saw deep knees, incredibly smooth skating, great control, lots of unison and speed. When they were juniors, they were graceful, but a bit slow and not dynamic. They've made huge strides in speed, power, unison and clarity and ease of movement. Lots of move as one (which is what connection means in figure skating). Their programs are arguably not as difficult as Meryl and Charlie's, but they strike me as much finer dancers and basic skaters, yet since their Worlds bronze medal they're getting crapped on (yes they have had some stumbles, but even when they skate beautifully they are no longer scored near DW in TES or components - I don't think).

The Olympic gold and silver medalists have continued to compete against each other and to be scored within a hair's breath - at least at major events where they compete against each other, the scores get a little bit closer. During the GP, DW's scores blow VM's out of the water, and let's not even talk about their respective nationals. The agenda at the US event appears to be to establish Meryl/Charlie as the best in the world, far out of even VM's reach, and the agenda at Canadians seems to be to establish Gilles/Poirier as the heirs to Virtue Moir.

The gold medalists have improved their skating on every level.The silver medalists have maintained their form, but the message we're supposed to hear is that DW are better or on par with VM. How do the gold medalists improve and the silver medalists maintain, but on the score sheet the silver medalists have advanced to where they're breathing down VM's neck? How does that happen? The team that stayed in place has somehow advanced on a better team that grew still more.

For God's sake, they beat VM on components which should never ever happen in any universe of figure skating, let alone ice dance.

I think their supporters would argue that Meryl and Charlie are finally being appreciated - that they were held down by politics in 2008-2009 (and yes, that result at Worlds was a joke).

But, it remains when I look at their skating from 2008-2009, they're the same skaters today doing the same elements the same way. All they change is their packaging. Die Fliedermaus was the same skating in a waltz package - the program, music, choreoraphy danced - the skaters did not, the elements did not. This year, they're trying to skate in a chemistry package - lots of beseeching arms and fevered facial expressions - still the same skating though - not just how they're skating it - but what they're skating. Is that rotational lift carrying through from 2008 to Sochi or will they actually do something different instead of claiming they are. The only time they actually did something different - the tango - they kept having to simplify it - taking out choreographic detail Moir and Virtue have been able to do since they were both teen-agers.

Virtue Moir have grown tremendously where it counts - where the blade meets the ice. But the scores ignore it.  It makes no sense at all. How have Meryl and Charlie improved since 2008-2009? They are strong individual skaters, in tremendous physical condition but what about their actual skating supports a claim that they are neck-and-neck with VM in ability?

I know CoP doesn't care, but in all the time DW have skated together, and their claims of connection, I've never seen either one react to or take an adjustment based off the other one while they're skating, which is something skaters with a connection should be able to do in a mutually interdependant sport.

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P.S. - if there's validity to these observations, I'll go further and say it has nothing to do with Marina politicking for DW.  It's an ISU thing - or the egregiously scratchy, shallow skating of G&P wouldn't have been scored as it was at the 4CCs. IMO in the short at Canadians GP didn't lay down nearly what Paul Islam did but still outscored them - and in that short Paul Islam matched whatever particular assets GP bring to the table. They were fast.  Their twizzles, edges and unison crushed GP.

Is the ISU afraid when Virtue Moir retire there is nobody like them left, so they're overvaluing - once again - hugely theatrical, bombastic performance styles and just looking the other way at the actual skating? The type of thing that made ice dance a joke prior to CoP establishing real criteria?

Is it because Meryl/Charlie are more accessible, dance every dance (so to speak) while VM are mysterious, apart, at times appear to project the belief that they think they're the smartest people in the room, and keep pushing their programs to where, if the ISU appreciated it, it would force the ISU to, you know, work harder, and force the judges and so called tech callers (who don't seem to be actual specialists, but more on par with assignees) to see better and improve their understanding of the sport?

P.S. this is the best place to throw this in - I've read (Sinead Kerr) and heard of (Kurt Browning, for God's sake) people questioning why there's no deduction for stopping a program and then resuming, as if these fine skaters and other people had never heard of such a thing until Virtue and Moir, as if Virtue and Moir got special treatment or slid through a loophole.

Where were these thoughtful people when Zhang & Zhang won the silver medal at the Torino Olympics after they had to stop their program because she landed a throw in a painful split? They got their bearings and resumed and won silver. At a TEB some years ago, Craig Buntin sliced his hand in the middle of a program. They had to stop and bandage his hand to staunch the bleeding. They then resumed, and made the podium. Alex Shibutani experienced a quad spasm, stopped, then he and Maia resumed their program. In all cases the public response was how heroic the skaters were, and good for them! It was a feel good story in the cases of those who resumed and did well enough for a podium finish. Inspiring triumph over adversity.

But VM? It's all "Don't get me wrong - they're one of the best teams ever but should this be allowed?"

What the hell. Is it so threatening to have that much talent?

P.S. I read so much on line fantasizing about the atmosphere at Arctic Edge - fans creating fan fiction, doing a whole lot of projecting, and then adopting their fan fiction and projections as fact. For some fans, it's now fact that things are terribly strained between DW and VM. Prior to this season, it was fact that DW were Igor's creatures and VM were Marina's creatures; one fan insisted it was well known abroad that Meryl and Igor were an item.

Lo and behold Igor is ousted and both teams remain. In this case, it was actually VM who issued the warmest and most sensible remarks on the situation - they kept themselves out of it while letting it be understood they were aware of the issue between Marina and Igor and agreed with the outcome (i.e., Scott saying "They had to part ways". Since Igor disagreed that they had to part ways, that would suggest Scott sees the situation from Marina's perspective). Saying that, they called Igor a friend and expressed confidence in his future success, as well as appreciation for all he'd done while working with them.

Of course Tessa gets her ass chewed later after the season started for saying that change is good and she'd told Margolio she had a renewed appreciation for skating.

While DW's recent remarks got a bye from the fandom. They were extremely chilly. They said it was none of their business, that it had nothing to do with them, and as they knew they were staying at Arctic Edge they focused on their own training, the end.

These were the remarks from the team the entire fandom insisted belonged to Igor, declared they KNEW DW belonged to Igor, and that their loyalty lay with him. And here DW let it be known that when the issues came up, in their view Igor was nonessential - Marina was essential and they considered training at Arctic Edge to = training with her.

A lot of the fandom either just wanked political reasons for why DW chose Igor (they weren't FREE to follow their hearts!) or ignored that DW's choice violated what they claimed was received wisdom. And it's the same now with DW versus VM on a personal level. Make shit up and carry on as if it's now established fact.