Monday, July 23, 2012
If Scott/Jessica were, for those who bought it, a WTF, every time Bryce speaks, the awareness that he was with Jessica personally as well as professionally reasserts that love is one of life's biggest mysteries. Bryce is driven, analytical, reflective, straightforward, insightful and generous. I miss his skating.
In this interview he is retired, but there's a feeling he could unretire, or at least that maybe in his heart he hasn't put to rest the possibility. If he never competes again, I'd kill to see him on BOTB and that show better get it done. I bet he'd win.
My points of note from this interview. One, he says he wishes he'd gotten into coaching sooner because it would have helped his skating/competing. Coaching helps you see elements technically, puts your focus on the mechanics and not just on performance.
I don't know what tricks Bryce's memory is playing on him but I recall from numerous media quotes that he always deconstructed the mechanics of his and Jessica's skating, always focused on both components of his job - the technical and the performance. He didn't need experience as a coach for that. It was easy to see that Bryce kept himself ferociously fit, that he'd applied himself to his double axel to keep his left hip under control when landing, and that, as David Pelletier said, even though Bryce was more slightly built than many pairs guys, his lifting technique was flawless and secure. You know he was always as aware of what was going on with the nuances of Jessica's balance and stability as much as his own job, that he was sensitive to how well she was doing hers and compensated when needed. You can see the difference in her face today when she's lifted by Sebastien Wolfe. Bryce had said he's not the biggest guy out there but he uses every bit, and we could see that too.
Hindsight is futile because it wouldn't have changed anything. He wasn't the person who would have benefitted from dispassionate focus on technique. That was Jessica. I remember when she was splatting her salchow in the Olympic season, Bryce deconstructed the mechanics in the media and explained what needed adjusting. It seemed pretty basic for someone like Jessica, who'd been doing the jump for years. Not that it helped. Maybe he really feels if he'd had experience coaching, he'd have been able to help her focus on that stuff.
I just hope he doesn't mean he could have improved his own work. I think he pushed himself as far as he could push HIMSELF. As driven as he is, to literally skate for two is impossible. To push the team further, he needed more cooperation from Jessica.
The second point of interest for me is Bryce refers to the intense financial pressures/stress of a skating career. Bryce comes from a skating family. The Davisons appear to be reasonably comfortable - they have a place in Muskoka where Jessica and her family were guests of the Davisons (the Davison place in Muskoka has had a bunch of skater guests, obviously). But still, finances were a challenge.
There's an annual Jessica Dube golf fundraiser in Drummondville to help defray the cost of her skating. Jessica has worn that red strapless skating costume into the ground - costumes are expensive. She and Bryce had some local sponsors; don't know what she has now. She comes from fairly modest circumstances, perhaps more modest than the Davisons, and even taking into account the combined resources of both families during D&D's career, the financial pressure was there.
Hard to reconcile these realities with the fact that in 2009 the three Dube siblings were able to muster up the money for a 4 star Dominican resort vacation getaway fitting in with Jessica's training break, splashing out for $89-$100 additional excursion fees like ziplining and catamaran trips. Even though the DR is cost-effective for Canadians (there's an invisible pipeline in the air from Canada to DR, no lie, don't even need passports, I believe), it was still interesting how room remained in their budget for vacations with their own friends (Jessica's brother vacationed in the sort of set-up where a bunch of guys bunk in per room in the resort).
Hard to reconcile Jessica's parents being in Paris in 2009 for TEB (an expensive time of year to travel to Paris) then returning to France (Nice) in 2012, and Monte Carlo and Monaco. That money could defray a lot of skating expenses.
Maybe I'm overlooking something but there were no reports of the Davisons at TEB 2009, and I don't think they routinely traveled to see Bryce compete overseas. Hell, neither family was in Colorado when Jessica's face was slashed, but Kate Virtue was, and she was the one who was on the phone to the Davisons to pass the developments to the Dubes. If Jessica needs fundraisers to offset her skating expenses, where did the funds to fly three people to the Dominican, two people to Paris (plus hotel and meals) and at least three people to Nice come from?
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You go, Bryce. I hope he goes far as a coach and that someday, he's able to skate again in some capacity because that's clearly where his heart is.
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone have idea what Jess and Seb are up to this season? I thought they were supposed to compete at Liberty but they must have withdrawn. Does Jess do anything besides plan her nonexistent wedding on Pinterest?
Sebastien has sent an upload from near New Derby, VT - haven't been able to see what if any stand-out skating facilities are in the region. He's got an event tagged but it's not skating. I expect they'll compete one or both of their programs later in the summer; possibly in Quebec, but I don't know.
DeleteI also hope to see Bryce skate again. I just got frustrated for him, watching this. He and Jessica had a successful career if you measure their career against the average pair team; they underachieved if you measure it against their real potential and Bryce's hopes. If he'd been able to convince her to apply themselves as they ought to have done, they could have competed against the best in the world internationally, instead of just picking up the pieces. I also got exhausted hearing him refer to the substantial amount of sports and psychological counseling they went through in order to keep themselves glued together through Vancouver. I feel a lot of that work entailed reconciling Bryce to his partner's attitude and habits. It's a shame, because for the most part, they were built to thrive off ice as a couple. But when you're with a partner, and your entire lives are devoted to a joint endeavor, sinking countless hours, dollars, passing on other opportunities for it, and you have completely different, noncomplementary ways of approaching it, and your partner's different way of approaching something costs you your dreams (that could have been achieved) - it's got to be a struggle to come to terms emotionally/psychologically, even if you're there already intellectually. It also impacts your off-ice harmony.
I think Bryce is going to be successful, grateful, all the things you'd want from retirement. But I think he wouldn't have a struggle to come to terms with his eligible career if he knew he and Jessica had maxed their potential given each season's circumstances. And he's knows they didn't, and it seems to me he still struggles with the idea that there's more he could have done. That's a champion's mentality, but IMO, futile. He did all that could be done when it comes to working with and partnering Jessica.
:( Bryce. You're absolutely right in that they could have been so much better than they were. I feel like we got a small glimpse of that at the 2008 Worlds. Their program, while not really technically as difficult as some, was magic.
DeleteI sometimes wonder what exactly it is that Jessica wants. Is she hoping to make the Sochi Olympics team? I'd rather eat my own shoe than watch her splat through another Olympics when another team would be so much more deserving of that spot.
I think it's to continue living the elite figure skater's life. The alternative is to really live in Drummondville - a lot of the routine travel she enjoys would end - and figure out what to do for a job the rest of her life. I have a half memory of Sebastien saying he's young and it's three years with the rest of his life to be a fire fighter.
DeleteI've watched most everything of D&D. In terms of skating quality, 2007-2008 was their best ever season. Even at their disappointing Nationals, you could see they'd put in the work. The edges and tracking and blade drive - unbelieveable. By the time they got to Goteberg, the foundation was there and they were positioned to capitalize on opportunity.
She threw it away the next season. Maybe it was the "pressure" of acquiring a 3 twist. Maybe she didn't like that along with the excitement of winning a world medal came enhanced expectations, including that you'd keep that level going and even raise the bar. (One of either Slipchuk or Thompson alluded to something like the latter being an issue.)
It's really up to the other Canadian pairs to take the Olympic slots. If I were them, I'd start by understanding that my federation doesn't give a shit about me and go after my career as if I were running my own business; no expectations, no resentments.
The money piece of all things Jessica continues to interest me. Let's give the benefit of the doubt and assume the Virtues are funding the Dube travels. No SC funds were used, no below the line monies in the budget siphoned off. Still, the reality is a lot of the skaters have never had a parent at an overseas competition; she's in their same circumstances and look at how privileged, all because of her role in helping Scott and Tessa lie. It's not the most sensitive way of doing business - to flaunt Jessica's sham perks at big events. It kind of shows off how important Scott and Tessa think they are - spending thousands and thousands of dollars other figure skaters don't have so Jessica will be buffered when she's shamming for them at international competitions. It's their money, but skaters are only human.
I'm sure the families of a lot of the Canadian team would have loved to go to Nice. It's the Virtue's business (if it's them) how they spend their money, but I can't imagine it's great for morale to see the perks an underachieving teammate recieves for non-skating services, not to mention the promotional consideration from Skate Canada. Successful but non-champion skaters like Weaver & Poje get excited when somebody makes a video about them (Scott and Tessa are up to their teeth and beyond in fan videos), or get a shout out. SC hyped Jessica last season, assisted her ice dance practice walkabout at the GPF where she trolled for autographs (where she wasn't even competing) and SC promoted her on twitter. It's bad sportsmanship all around, and on the SC side it's worse than that.
"The money piece of all things Jessica continues to interest me. Let's give the benefit of the doubt and assume the Virtues are funding the Dube travels."
Delete^^This.
I'm very interested in the money piece as well. I've seen the speculations about the Virtues being very well off, but even for them this seems excessive. That was quite a bit of money laid out in the last five years for the sake of a fake girlfriend. Or maybe that's just me, thinking it's been such an OTT expenditure. I'm also interested in whether the Virtues/Moirs continue having any kind of agreement with Jessica that involves money, in spite of an (apparently) official break-up with Scott. For example, any further expenses paid for costuming, choreography, other compensations? She is after all still the ex-girlfriend, not a non-girlfriend, as you pointed out in another comment. Maybe the "ex" status still involves specific perks (bribes).
It's just so crass. If you're going to have a 5 year sham, don't keep it in-house so the have-nots see the way the haves throw away their money in the interest of their own-self-importance and control freak needs. Did Sebastien's parents get to see their kid skate in France at his first and maybe only ever Worlds? To employ Skate Canada's machinery in this enterprise when Skate Canada can't get off its ass to take an interest in promoting the skaters below international podium level, being too preoccupied with this, is just gross. Figure skating is insular enough, this just flaunted a privileged isolation from the real world which is, btw, not the same as being "unique". It's entitlement. Furthermore, so much of it comes down to the choice of Jessica. It's because Scott didn't want to be around her that an army of supernumeraries were employed putting stagecraft in place. Otherwise Moir and Dube could (literally) take a hike, have a meal, hit a photogenic area of Paris for some snapshots like Tanith/Evan did, and done. So that's personal. It's not the marketing or p.r. It's a costly blunder down to having chosen the sham person like a bunch of idiots. It certainly appear to me that Debbi is equally insightful in all of her SC endeavors.
Delete"like Tanith/Evan did"
Deleteor as Fedor and Tessa appeared to do as well
Fedor and Tessa actually were friends, as Fedor is with most of the Canton skaters. Yes, they (Fedor and Tessa) did do that - they didn't just appear to do that.
DeleteIf you need the type of infrasture, expense and organizational planning required to set up the Jessica stuff, something's gone wrong. You shouldn't be doing it. That itself should signal it's time to back out of it. Instead they just threw more resources at it. None of them helped make it convincing; the opposite, in fact. They are so perverted. Oops, the man involved doesn't want to expend his own time and energy with the woman. So involve her family, his family, Tessa's family AND Skate Canada. Skate Canada resources are wasted on something that could have been done by the skaters themselves a la the examples of Tanith/Evan and Tessa/Fedor, and it seems obvious that the way to manage a failed faux match isn't to throw money and institutional resources you don't have at it. I wonder how the other skaters felt seeing resources wasted on this crap.
Love Bryce. Such an amazing skater and all-around decent person.
ReplyDeleteOne thing I wondered while listening to this interview. In addition to assuming they were providing privacy cover for V/M, did Skate Canada think that creating a love-triangle of Bryce-Jessica-Scott would in fact help the team of D/D focus better and get the job done to the potential they had? IMO the logic sounds stupid but I wouldn't put it past Skate Canada. Or David Pelletier. Funny how he seems to be around D/D and V/M a whole lot around that time.
Yes (as to D&D being intended beneficiaries of the sham as well as V&M) It was an agreement and there are two sides to an agreement although I don't know much about D&D's end of it. Also, track back to when Debbi Wilkes was hired in I think August 2006. D&D had obviously been a couple at the Olympics a few months before. The next time they were in the news, it was early in 2007, post face slash, and lo, D&D were freshly platonic-ked. One of the first post-slash reports was written in purple - Dube opens her big brown eyes and sees the face of her ex-boyfriend and still best friend (classic Skate Canada, that). Bryce of course goes on to say how incredibly close they got after the slash - close in that platonically extra intimate way only Skate Canadian figure skaters achieve. (Maybe there's a yoga course they could develop?) Two months later fsu reports that "according to Scott, he is dating Jessica Dube." So hell yeah. They got that one done quick. Kill two birds with one totally imbecilic idea, protect both their little nascent championship teams by cross-pollinating the ice dancer and the pairs kater.
DeleteWhen I look back at Pelletier and D&D, a lot of it now looks to me like public relations. D&D inheriting the mantle of S&P, S&P taking D&D under their wing. Jessica clutching a note from Jamie and David that we then see her reading. It's funny how a few years later Bryce swept that whole S&P influence under the rug, but SC was banging that drum a long time. I don't know how much to put to Pelletier's influence (these half-assed ideas) and how much to Pelletier just going along for the self-promotion ride himself. Remember SC also started up a little bit of the same dynamic with "Marie and Patch" and VP for awhile - not as resonant though, because D&L weren't world or Olympic champions.
"[Jessica clutching a note from Jamie and David that we then see her reading.]"
DeleteI never saw this. That's hilarious.
Skate Canada is ridiculous.
Here you go:
Deletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PMgeBJLTb4
Questions for the blogger:
Delete1- do you think dube and davison's split had to do with seemingly normal and nice bryce becoming fed up with cooperating the scam?
2- how much of a role did david pelltier play in setting up the scam...seems he was hanging awfully close to d/d and v/m in 2008, about when the scam began, and when his marriage was crumbling and he and jamie were putting on the happy couple facade...coincidence?
No, to the question about Bryce and the sham. Hell, he was keeping her on sham track at WTT - look at him cold-shouldering her on camera except when they skated (which he did not do behind the scenes). Look at him remove his arm from around her when the camera returns to the KnC after they had their splat short, look at that infamous screen cap of Igor/Tessa/Scott reading a sheet of paper on the right, Jessica a sullen lump in the middle, Bryce all the way over to the side looking away from her. He was a value add, not a conscientious objector.
DeleteI don't know about Pelletier's role in the scam - the longer it goes on the more it seems this platonic romance thing was some overarching brainstorm/policy of Debbi's or whomever cooks up Skate Canada's ridiculous marketing premises.
The sham didn't have anything to do with Bryce and Jessica's break-up. Bryce is normal and nice but he's not a marketing wizard either. He talked about how "Way We Were" was music straight in the wheelhouse of "our audience" and how he believed judges were only human, and if the audience was moved, the judges would be influenced. That sounded wack to me, but he said it and alluded to that theory several times. Their goal was to make the audience cry. That, to me, is completely ass backwards. Do your job and the result will follow, don't go after a performance with a result in mind. I also think they're overrating Way We Were as an emo-button for baby boomers. He gave plenty of interviews discussing his relationship with Jessica. He participated in that "Menage" thing - he's not shy, and he didn't perceive the way the audience would take his remark about it being difficult to see them together and his friendship severed. Of course the audience is going to blow by the implication that he and Jessica won't be hanging with Scott and Tessa at competitions, where they have work to do (thus letting Scott off the hook). Fans immediately seized on OMG, Scott and Bryce are feuding. There was even a story (fsu) that the two men, who don't skate together and trained in different provinces, had to undergo monthly psychological mediation at the instigation of Skate Canada. What a wtf that rumor was. Scott was skating brilliantly with Tessa and seemed happy as a clam, Jessica had been a pain in the ass long before the sham started - it wasn't Bryce who was impacting her performance in the run up to Vancouver. It was D&D undergoing psychological counseling and not about Scott. I have a theory - only a theory, that I'll add below this.
About D&D - they had training struggles - I've described these before. Jessica was also not always Ms. Popular among his friends (versus her/their friends at the Contre Coeur training center - what that means, I don't know.
DeleteI do know that Bryce was extremely driven, a real competitor, and truly wanted a legitimate shot at the Vancouver podium. He and Jessica both have tatoos, that they got at the same time (and have interviewed about) - Olympic ring tatoos. Knowing that people around Scott (not people involved in the sham) believe Jessica and Pelletier had a fling, that has to be reconciled with not just Bryce's, but his family's continued support of, enabling of and friendship towards Jessica throughout. Even though his competitive fate was tied to her, I don't think his family are such craven ho's that they'd suck up to a girl who had betrayed him. They wouldn't extend constant encouragement, always make her welcome at their homes, praise her, give presents, etc., and constantly, constantly reassure her, which they did.
A girl who was acting out/pissed off that Bryce had put their personal relationship on hold in the belief it would take the tension out of their Vancouver preparation - a girl who was mad, upset - that's a girl Bryce's family might coddle, jolly along, give morale support to, continue to treat as a member of the family, even be flattered on their brother's behalf that the personal relationship was as important as the skating relationship was to her.
I think this drama took place in 2008-2009 and by 2009-2010 Jessica had convinced him they were better with their relationship as it was - she certainly made her point in 2008-2009 (if I'm right) that keeping things professional wouldn't help her results.
P.P.S. - there's a great video clip - a bumper - from 2007. Tessa's red head phase. The bumper shows she and Bryce smiling, and chatting, side-by-side, very happily, and Jessica in the foreground, looking stoic-but-more-like-cut-a-bitch. I've always wondered if Jessica's reaction to the idea of Tessa and Bryce shamming prompted a switch. Tessa and Bryce are the more logical pairing. Tessa stays on message, smiles brightly, is composed always. Bryce is professional, smart, trustworthy; Scott could trust him with Tessa and then some (besides, Bryce belonged to Jessica). That just seems like such a low maintenance idea that would run itself. The idea of taking Scott - who is explosive, heart on his sleeve, openly worshipful of Tessa - and matching him with Jessica the mood queen - seems like asking for trouble. So it makes me wonder if Bryce/Tessa wasn't the original idea only Jessica couldn't handle it. I need to find that clip (Tessa might be in the red warm-ups with the red hair - there are other clips of her wearing that, but I haven't re-found this bumper. Jessica's face says volumes).
Delete"I also think they're overrating Way We Were as an emo-button for baby boomers."
DeleteNothing to do with the sham, but this shows their idiotic marketing ideas (Skate Canada?). I'm considered a baby boomer and while I didn't mind The Way We Were in the 70's, by the 80's and 90's I was heartily sick of it and D/D skating to it didn't change my mind. The baby boomers were raised on Rock-and-Roll, the Beatles, Rolling Stones, Led Zeppelin, Aerosmith...
The Way We Were? Please, give me a break.
If it's people like Debi and Barb at Skate Canada giving this kind of advice they don't even know their own generation.
Not to mention, they were consciously playing into what they'd put out about D&D - the former couple who wanted to skate Way We Were on the ice. Which is, in real world terms, idiotic. What couple would want to do that? Life isn't a movie. It was a manipulative concept and they played it up. The ex couple skating a tearful, poignant program about being an ex couple. They weren't in their thirties and forties or even late twenties - they were both early twenties - it made no sense to have them skate like middle-aged people looking back and yearning, let alone pretend it reflected their actual circumstances: Oh - I wish I hadn't dumped you for Scott - or part of me wishes that!! Oh Jessica - didn't we almost have it all!
DeleteRidiculous.
"Oh - I wish I hadn't dumped you for Scott - or part of me wishes that!! Oh Jessica - didn't we almost have it all!"
DeleteYou mean when you broke up with someone you didn't feel like spending time with him/her, yearning for the past? And becoming platonic BFF?
Bwahahaha!
Any skater can skate to anything they please, and I'm sure there really are a lot of middle-aged people who love the song The Way We Were. The problem IMO is when the skaters come out and say stupid stuff like they chose a particular piece of music to appeal to a certain audience. Then it's just patronizing. Any "certain audience" will include huge variables and many who don't agree with whoever decided they represented a specific stereotype. If D/D had just kept it simple (stupid) and had said something along the lines of, "We connect with this music," there's more probability of actually getting people to pay attention and "connect" along with them. But when instead they patronizingly put it on some abstract audience who they acknowledge they want to emotionally manipulate, then it's What the Hell?
Bryce's comments about their music choice is a little too reminiscent of Scott and Tessa saying equally stupid things about how fans wanted them to get together because naturally that's what they wanted for the characters of a romantic movie, or that Scott was supposed to be like George Clooney. They all sounded like they were just repeating something someone else told them sounded like a good idea. Gee, I wonder if that could have been those marketing wizards at SC?
Debbi's instincts are just ass, let's face it. She always overlooks the most obvious problem with her premises. With the "tough" campaign, she overlooked what figure skating IS. With Jessica and Bryce at 22 and 23-24 it's pretty much, well guys, you can always get back together if the misty water color memories make you this distraught. Convenient, too!
DeleteAnd let's just ignore the sordid scenario Debbi was flogging on the OTHER side of the mattress - the Scott/Jessica thing. That just made Way We Were icky and weird.
In terms of Sochi - there is no doubt that Duhamel/Radford are the number 1 pair - barring any injuries. This is a pair that is also older and has paid their dues - especially Meghan. So I think the coddling of Dube/Wolfe won't be as apparent this year.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the Bryce video. In the end D/D had great potential but really needed a coaching change. From the video, you can tell Bryce definitely has regrets. As you stated earlier, both athletes whether in pairs/ice-dance have to have the same work ethic in order to succeed and be willing to listen to criticism. Talent itself is not guaranteed to make you a world champion in any sport.
Duhamel/Radford were number one last year too. SC knew D/W weren't going to beat them. The best D/W was expecting was to land on the podium, which they achieved thanks to MTM's collapse. I don't think it's DR's status that impacts the coddling of Dube Wolfe, because they were cosseted last season too (I think a lot of people had DR figured for the championship - there were so many points in their program - even though MTM were the reigning champs).
DeleteIf the coddling is absent this season I believe it goes to Jessica no longer being "Scott's gf." I do believe the money questions and other SC consideration questions are uncomfortable issues as well as extremely stupid internal politics.
They couldn't shut it down when it was first questioned; that looks like guilt. They can shut it down so it doesn't repeat for the coming season. We'll see.
"even if the DR is cost-effective for Canadians (there's an invisible pipeline in the air from Canada to DR, no lie, they don't even need passports, I believe)"
ReplyDeletehaha wouldnt that be nice indeed?! a pipeline in the air AND not needing a passport, if only! :D
an average trip to DR, 3 to 6 nights, ALL inclusive, (drinks, meals, day events etc), 2 ways, would run anywhere from $600 + for 1 person, some times you can get a honeymoon package for as cheap as $1050. So for most Canadians who spend 6+ months of the year under a thick layer of freezing cold snow, if we can afford it, you bet we get away for a week!
so is that around the same price point for any of you other anons or you OC?
Yep, the price sounds similar for an all inclusive, but I know the day events attended by Scott and Jessica at the resort where the Dube sibs and Scott stayed were extra (around $89.00 per person in spring 2009). The ziplining, the Saona island trip, not to mention the car rental to check out Santa Domingo. At some resorts the Santa Domingo trip would be included, but that's on in-resort transport (a bus) and the resort schedule, not a rental car, which is how they did it. The car you'd have to rent.
DeleteHere's another overview or rates and amenities at the resort patronized by Scott and the Dube sibs:
http://www.oyster.com/dominican-republic/hotels/dreams-punta-cana-resort-and-spa/#
It's all inclusive but not bargain rates, and activities like beach horseback riding are extra, so are the others I mentioned.
Here's the scoop from World Travel - basically if you're Canadian you may enter with a Canadian birth certificate (outlined below) and photo i.d.
"Canadian citizens must have a passport valid upon arrival in the Dominican Republic. Passport exemptions apply to travellers in possession of an original birth certificate, birth registration papers, a military hospital-issued birth certificate, Canadian Citizenship Certificate or Naturalization Certificate issued to Nationals of Canada. If not including a photo of the bearer, these documents must be accompanied by an official photo ID document (e.g. driver's licence); and visitors must travel for touristic purposes only. Note that it is recommended that Canadian citizens be in possession of a valid passport upon arrival in the Dominican Republic. A visa is not required, provided that visitors obtain a Tourist Card on arrival for a maximum stay of 30 days."
US travelers need a passport.
well, we may not need one to get into the DR, but we need one to leave and re-enter Canada. We are allowed, however, to fly without a passport within our own boarder, but since you need 2 pieces of government issued, non photo i.d(birth certificate and S.I.N card would be 2) and then an additional government issued photo i.d., of which there is only 3 you can obtain now in every province, a passport, a regular drivers license or an enhanced drivers license (allows you to cross the Canada/U.S boarder by land and water only) as well, some provinces have an i.d. card that people can buy and it looks like a drivers license but obviously doesn't allow you to drive, but not every province has this... the choices are limiting and it makes more sense to just use a passport when flying, even inside our own Country.
Deletehttp://www.aircanada.com/en/travelinfo/before/traveldoc.html#-int
I was rewatching the Olympic FD (happy Olympics everyone!) and...just for a moment, I could see one small reason why the sham might have had merit (as a concept, obviously not in its execution). A season-long story of this newlywed couple skating the Mahler program would have been impossible to protect from getting cheesy. Knowing now in retrospect, I don't find it cheesy at all, but the haters would have gone nuts and commentators as a group are annoying enough as it is. Still, the sham was well on its way a couple years before, so it probably wasn't the original raison d'etre...then again it sounds like they had the next 20 years planned out as teens, so who knows)
ReplyDeleteThe thing is, though, how many people, including how many fans, already knew Scott and Tessa were together prior to and in the run-up to the Olympics. And also knew their enhanced status. Denial isn't, imo, the problem with the sham. That's their privilege. If they wanted protection from the international broadcast television cheesiness or public fan speculation, then don't be a couple on the record; the networks can't do profiles and allude to your status if you're not, and most casual fans will accept it - if they don't, there's not much they can do about it. The real need in the "shield from cheesiness" scenario is not to be a romantic couple on the record. You don't need the Dominican, Xmas, Paris and the circus they performed. Considering their real circumstances, all of that remains revolting.
DeleteYes, as has been discussed with the similar issue of 'would it make watching them being sexy weird', so many people knew already. But "they wanted protection from the international broadcast television cheesiness or public fan speculation" is more what I was thinking about. How things are framed can have a huge impact on public perception.
Deletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGhtM2rqbYA&feature=related
ReplyDelete3:01 - 3:14 - who would you say is the one at the boards, wanting to jump over it to get to Jess?
Well if I had to guess I would say it would be Michael Slipchuk or someone with accredidation. I would be shocked if 2007 Scott Moir was watching an event in khakis - definitely a jeans guy....
DeleteIf you mean the person in khakis with one leg kneeling on the boards; he's wearing credentials and not trying to get to her. It appears he's waiting for a cell phone to be passed to him by the two women he's kneeling near, and when he gets it, it appears he straightens out and begins speaking on the phone, gesturing towards the ice.
DeleteI've never watched this until now, ugh. Jess gets some credit for ever going back on the ice. But the commentator (Martini?) says no doubt about it that Bryce travels, but that's not what it looks like to me. Bryce maybe a bit, but JD just as much or more?
DeleteIt's obvious they both travel. It's been awhile since I've watched, but I've seen it from multiple angles. She travels a fair bit, then Bryce closes the gap by traveling a bit himself, and it happens.
DeleteI can understand Jessica, as a nineteen year old, being most relieved that there was no lasting cosmetic damage to her face (the scar that remains is her choice - she has said she likes it and thinks it makes her look tough. Otherwise laser treatment could have made it much less noticeable). But last season, during one of the summer competitions, she and Sebastien got extremely close during the sbs camel spins, an incidence P.J. Kwong called terrifying. Jessica laughed it off. Sure she's not going to go all melodrama about it, but I thought the laughing was weird. I also thought that Sebastien's blade position in the death spiral at Worlds was extremely scary; it got much too close to her skull.
P.S. - the Scott/Jessica sham wasn't a thing at 4CC's 2007.
DeleteP.P.S. There are so many better ways to handle/dismiss what happened than Jessica's chosen way of being mysterious. She could so easily have said we both traveled, instead of "I don't know" and making so terribly understanding about Bryce's guilt. It's worth mentioning that Jessica calls the changes of foot and position in the sbs spins for both of her pairings; she is the person who runs that element. Bryce has said that it's the man's job to protect his partner on the ice in pairs, and of course, that's the standard, but this happens to be an element that Jessica controls - it wouldn't necessarily protect her from what happened, but it does or should make her aware of exactly where both she and her partner are in the spins.
Deletehttp://www.journalexpress.ca/Société/Potins/2012-07-27/article-3040869/La-Bande-a-Bonneau-du-29-juillet-2012/1
ReplyDeleteOn Saturday, September 8th will take place on the corridors of the golf club Majorique Drummond St., the third annual golf tournament for athletes of Drummondville. This year's event will be held for the benefit of Great sport Drummondville and skater Jessica Dube, silver medalist at the Canadian Figure Skating Championships. This is also Miss Dube who will act as patron of the activity. The organizing committee expects to make a full house for this tournament and dinner to follow. The cost of participation was set at $ 90 for golf and dinner and $ 25 for dinner only. Officials ask those interested to register by August 10. For registration or more information, please contact RÉAL TREMBLAY at 819 471-3640; TEDDY SAINT-PIERRE MARIO at 819 850-4970 or 819 397-2327 DUBÉ at 819 314-5145 or ...
so do i understand it right that she is going to be profiting from this benefit golf/dinner event? that she is some how still getting a free ride?
I believe this event was held last year too. It's not sham-related; it's not unusual for a figure skater's community to do some fundraising to help offset the skater's expenses, which are, as everyone knows, prohibitive. Patrick Chan has interviewed about the fund raisers held for his figure skating. What makes this relevant is Jessica is among the skaters who needs her community to pitch in and help financially. Scott and Tessa, by contrast, in recent times have attended the annual Ilderton Bursary Golf Championship; http://www.ildertonskating.on.ca/resources/ILDERTON%20SKATING%20CLUB%20BURSARY%20GOLF%20CLASSIC.pdf, which is held to financially support club skaters who are not Tessa and Scott. They serve as headliners/draws for the event.
DeleteYes in 2009 Jessica and her two siblings were all at what is rated as a five star Punta Cana resort, spending additional on outside excursions, there so Jessica's two siblings could 'join' Jessica and Scott on their annual romantic vacation as a couple. Which makes complete sense, of course. What adult siblings wouldn't want to spend a lot of their own money doing that for a vacation instead of going somewhere with their own friends or SO? What young (21-year olds) duo wouldn't want the brother and sister tagging along? Wonderful the Dubes can afford this, except they can't.
That fall, for TEB, she had both of her parents with her. This wasn't a case of let's go to Paris and find the best airline rate - this had to be scheduled to coincide with TEB. Then this past Worlds she had her parents and her brother with her in Nice, which as we all know is an expensive place, and Jessica's brother and parents' hotel, meals and flights are not expensed by the ISU. Yet she's having the golf tournament again to help underwrite her figure skating. We know how rare it is for figure skaters of ordinary means to have their families with them when they compete, especially in the more glamorous, high end locales, and I'd count Paris and Nice as two of those. Jessica isn't paying for these trips; her family isn't paying for these trips. It's always been when Scott and Tessa were competing at the same event.
Who is paying for it? One presumes the Virtues. I'm not dismissing Skate Canada's potential contribution - the directors - all of them - live a comfortable lifestyle, even those you wouldn't think would have raked it in in the past, such as Barb. The federation isn't rolling in sponsorhip dough, but the directors live well. Is it SC money or Virtue money and will we see it displayed again on Jessica's behalf? For that matter, who put up Jessica and her dad at the GPF in Quebec last year, so she could do her conspicuous walkabout at the ice dance practice and watch the competition? I realize it's Quebec, her own province, but she was there more than one day and again this is a woman who needs financial support to figure skate, and she wasn't there on any (official) SC business, as she was for the day trip she and Bryce took to promote the Quebec GPF.
arg...spoiled brat getting everything handed to her on a bronze place...i mean plate
Deleteare the virtues that rich?
ReplyDeleteMinimally, extremely comfortable. I think all three top Canton teams come from very comfortable circumstances, going by the fact that family travels with them to all international competitions, that they all enjoy expensive supplementary support for their training (the many instructors and outsiders - all of whom need to be paid, many the best in their field - Corky Ballas isn't cheap, for instance), and many other indicators. None of the teams were ever in the situation of Chock & Geurlein, who put together a bunch of part time jobs while training at Canton. Tessa's favorite places to shop and the clothes and shoes she wears are also usually extremely high end and were long before the Olympics. She wore a Herve Legere' bandage dress to worlds months ahead of a couple of US celebrities hit the red carpet in the same dress, so she sometimes even has the jump on professional stylists. The family has the money for this.
DeleteI'd wonder why they don't just pay off Jessica by underwriting her figure skating, instead of this family travel stuff, but there's something in it for them in the latter arrangement. In Paris, her parents provided a buffer for the Moirs and Scott during the Paris walkabout, plus it was a bonus to have them in the photos - it provided an excuse for the Moirs to be there as well, so Scott wouldn't want to shoot himself before the end of the day. Jessica has gotten some skating-related perks - SC promotion, presumably the Zoueva choreography, but I think in a way the fact that she and Scott are an uncomfortable match as a faux couple has worked out to her benefit.
"but I think in a way the fact that she and Scott are an uncomfortable match as a faux couple has worked out to her benefit."
DeleteOh my gosh, yes, everything about Jessica and Scott always came across as extremely uncomfortable.
But in what way do you mean this has worked out to her benefit?
ok, i get that the Virtues are comfortable but come on, Tessa and Scott do make some big bucks now when they win first or second - WTT @ 20% of $160.000 = $32.000 to share between T&S which = $16.000 for her. Worlds @ $40.500 split to share = $20.000 for her. Skate Canada, Trophee Eric B, and Grand Prix final all at $18.000 split to share = 9 grand for each. 4CC 2012 i couldnt find a prize amount so i am using 2011 which was $22.500 split for 2 = $11.250. Also couldnt find prize amounts for Finlandia and Canadian Figure Skating Championship...but with all those ones i did find girl raked in $74.250 last year alone and thats not with CSOI or anything else that could be thought of...that's a nice chunk of chance to go shopping with...and a dress for 2 grand doesnt seem at all pricey when we are in digits like this...
Delete$74 k is certainly a decent salary, but not uncommon for the processons, for example. So even if they're both pulling in that: pay Canadian taxes, pay for everything figure skating related and raise a child and still live the jet-setting Holt Renfrew lifestyle? I don't think so. Besides she was wearing designer clothing as a teenager.
ReplyDeleteIs anyone else getting fanforum blocked for malicious content? I don't know if my antivirus is just being overzealous or if the site is having issues?
*professions
ReplyDeleteAnons above - yes, it's clearly not coming out of their pockets, not to mention it's been going on since before the Olympics, and skating teams are awarded prize money and paid as a unit, not a separate prize for each. They split it. As nice as that amount may seem, it can't begin to support the different aspects of their training and conditioning, coaching, living expenses, a high end designer wardrobe and non-competition, non-underwritten travel.
Delete"Oh my gosh, yes, everything about Jessica and Scott always came across as extremely uncomfortable.
But in what way do you mean this has worked out to her benefit?"
That if Scott had been friends with her, they could have dispensed with the large supporting cast and the logistics and just posed on their own. Imagine, for example, if Tessa and Bryce had been the shammers. Can you picture Debbi M gripping his arm leading him to a stone-faced Tessa while the other skaters mingled freely? Can you picture him basically hostage in the Moir seats waiting for his cue? Can you picture him showing up at the GPF ice dance practice with Probation Officer Alma on one side and Social Worker Kate on the other? An army of Scott surrogates (Cara, etc.) so Scott himself only has to spend minimal time around her? The Virtues paying for the Davisons to come to Paris or Nice so Tessa (and her family) would be spared talking to him in between camera clicks? They pay for the Dubes as much because THEY want the Dubes there as a buffer. Sure, it's nice to show "both families" together posing weirdly around Paris, but if the Dubes weren't there it would be Scott, his parents, and Jessica walking around, and that would look weird. Why's he taking his parents with him while walking around romantic Paris with his gf? Well, because he doesn't really want to be the one babysitting her or dealing with her. Add in her parents and it looks more legitimate.
Basically, the lack of friendship between them, and Scott's lack of interest in trying to be friends, meant the Virtue Moir side needed someone else to babysit Jessica during on-location photo calls, cause it ain't gonna be Scott. So it's her family. So it's almost a plus for her not to be friends with Scott, as the need for buffers means her family gets travel perks. What the deal was at Worlds, though, is curious. As yet, no sham stuff has emerged, but it's unclear if the decision to make her "former" occurred before or after. If it was before, than that's a staight pay-off, a parting gift.
8:14
DeleteIf it's true Scott really doesn't like Jessica and can't stand to spend time with her, the enormous amount of social-media photos and posts featuring Scott and Jessica as a couple is hilariously ironic. This stuff is going to live on in cyberspace forever, accessible to anyone.
Let me guess....they didn't think about that ahead of time (nor plan what to do about it when they no longer wanted this to be part of their public personas). *rolleyes*
I think it's a given they overlooked major problems with the sham, including the living on cyberspace forever part. To me it all looks like - oh look - social media! A place where we can fake it without being accountable, a place to have a one-way street completely under our control! And we can always delete stuff when we're done with it!
DeleteWhat idiots. When I look at how they manage everything else it's no wonder they failed to realize internet photos could be saved, and that fans would save them (you know the private flickr accounts out there are legion). Or that fans could push back.
As to realizing that locking down Jessica as Scott's sham gf would be a long term problem, consider the situation when it started. I don't think either Scott or Tessa imagined shamming still in 2012. When the idea of Jessica/Scott first reached fans (it surfaced on fsu in spring 2007, even though Jessica forgets this and has put the start date as March 2008), it was just a couple of months after Jessica's face slash and most of Skate Canada was on a Jessica worship jag, because she was back on the ice and competed at Worlds 2007, and because she was staunch with Bryce - and because everybody loves Bryce and it's so great this only made them stronger. And, her spoken English wasn't fabulous back then. After 4CC's 2007 there was stuff like "Jess is my hero!" from other skaters on facebook.
I don't think dealing with Jessica one-on-one was something the Moirs or Virtues had a lot of experience doing. They knew the Davisons much better, and she was his partner, and of course a very familiar fellow figure skater at all the same competitions and training camps, going back years. Part of the family. I don't think her ups and downs or overall personality were appreciated in full until about a year in, maybe longer. In 2007-2008 Scott was mega-preoccupied with Tessa's legs and not focused on much else. By the time they were in a position to get a real sense of Jessica as an individual off the ice, they were in the pre-Olympic season and looking at the Olympic year. Too late.
"By the time they were in a position to get a real sense of Jessica as an individual off the ice, they were in the pre-Olympic season and looking at the Olympic year. Too late."
DeleteIf this was their thinking, IMO all it does is reinforce their lack of common sense, professional advice, even integrity. "Too late?" When someone wants to do things in a right way, it's never too late to get it done. Granted, sometimes it may mean a large dose of humble pie, but to not fix this kind of mistake on the excuse that it's too late, or too embarrassing, or too whatever, and so therefore one might as well continue the disastrous blunder, is just that - an excuse. It looks like V/M and the others involved are absolutely determined to maintain a public lie about themselves, regardless of cost or integrity or even consequences.
This has been bothering me for a while now but why is this blog the only place claiming these facts about Scott and Tessa? Everywhere else, except FF on occasion, scoffs at what's posted here. You must believe it since you've been so passionately asserting the same thing for years, so it's just odd.
ReplyDeleteIt's the only public place. It's also one of the places where people can post as anon.
DeleteI would measure the FF situation not by how rarely it comes up - but by the number (not insignificant) who say they buy what the blog says when it does, and the passive aggressive way these people are bullied into silence by others.
DeleteAnon 11:57
DeleteBesides the fact that this blog is the only place one can post anonymously (OC 5:38) and the bullying into silence mentioned by Anon 5:39, I think the fans are generally very respectful of Tessa and Scott and on public boards and in person they're willing to overlook all the contradictions and weirdness that's talked about here. Just look at the respect shown V/M during the meet-and-greets during SOI. No one asked about nor alluded to their personal lives. The fans were respectful and showered them with love and admiration. I would venture to say most fans feel that way, even all the ones who visit and post on this blog, no matter what they believe is true or not true.
Here's how I see it: the figure skating community is small. Countless fans cross-post on the major message boards, which are fsu, goldenskate, and livejournal. There's also fanforum and addicted. A lot of this is the same people. I, personally, am aware of more than a few posters who know perfectly well Scott and Tessa are together but go along to get along. Despite the anonymity of the internet, I believe the "community" impulse is stronger and many fans will sacrifice honest expression of opinion for community. A lot also just don't have the energy for the argument. This community impulse is emphasized by the reality that most message boards require registering a screen name. That guarantees that any outlier opinion will turn into personal shaming, critique.
DeleteWilliam Thompson "retires"....it was on my local news
ReplyDeletehttp://www.skatecanada.ca/AboutUs/NewsDetails/tabid/2157/sni%5B2797%5D/1819/language/en-US/Default.aspx
(cont'd) I got my hopes up, but it doesn't sound like it means big changes.
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